bl0498 Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Guys/Ladies, A brief summary of what was agreed at the technical forum last Sunday. For some items there are details still to be worked out but what follows should enable competitors to reasonably assess whether they wish to enter the Lotus 7 Club Speed Championship in 2006 and also to assess which class to enter and what are the basic regulations in each class. Note that what is provided below is given in good faith, but is subject to details being concluded, final approval by MSA etc. We would not expect to publish definitive regulations before the first month or so of 2006. Firstly many thanks to all those competitors who spent time airing their views etc last Sunday - it was much appreciated. Amendments to Technical Regulations: Class 1: Will be amended to include the older/current specification of Caterham Academy and Supergrad cars as long as they are unmodified. Max 120bhp. Rebore allowance for 1600 crossflows - will be max 60thou overbore No sequential gearboxes. Class 2/3: Will be amended to permit the following modifications to 1600K engines: K16 head porting retaining standard valves, verniers, 52mm throttle body and forged pistons. Will be amended to permit the following modifications to 1800K engines: verniers, 52mm throttle body and forged pistons. The following modifications will be prohibited on 1600k engines: Use of VVC/VHPD cylinder heads, reprogrammable ECUs, VVC plenums, throttle bodies larger than 52mm. The following modifications will be prohibited on 1800K engines: Any porting of the K16 cylinder head or use of VVC or VHPD heads, reprogramable ECUs, VVC plenum chambers, throttle bodies larger than 52mm. No sequential gearboxes. Class 4/5: All cars must be fitted with a reverse gear. Class 6: It is likely that all cars in this class must be fitted with a reverse gear too but this is TBD at present. All classes: Maximum noise level 108dB at 0.5m. (Certain events may impose lower limits) There will be a general 'spirit of regulations' regulation to reclassify cars if necessary. Amendments to Scoring: Class Scoring: Current system retained with minor amendments. Max points for 1st place will be 21.0 (not 21.5 as at present). Points for 2nd/3rd etc as now. Additional up to 0.5 points for breaking class record available all competitors that break the class record. New venues TBD - for 2006 it is likely to be used to set class records only. Championship: Likely to be 7 events to count (although may be 5 for novices/ladies). Novices/Ladies scoring to be as for class scoring totalled up as now for best 5. Main championship to be scored using (say) 25 for first place in each class at an event, 24 for second place, down to 1. Up to 0.5 for breaking class record added - as for class scoring. Total of best 7 events. Full details TBD. Very Provisional Calendar: Sunday 23rd April - Longcross (Confirmed) Sunday 30th April - Llandow (trackday on 29th). L7CGB event Saturday 20th May - Curborough © L7CGB event (Sunday 21st May - Curborough Marshals sprint - not championship event) Saturday/Sunday 3rd/4th June - Pembrey (2 x 1 day events - Now Confirmed) Saturday 24th June - MIRA (P) L7CGB event Saturday 1st July - Shelsley Walsh © Sunday 16th July - Longcross 2 © Saturday 29th July - Loton Park © (Saturday 26th August - Curborough Marshals sprint - not championship event) Sunday 27th August - Curborough 2 © L7CGB event Saturday 2nd September - Aintree © Saturday 9th September - Wiscombe © Sunday 17th September - Harewood © All (P) above are provisional and very much TBC!!! I hope I have remembered everything! Brian Edited to amend Championship Scoring to include Class Record breaking points. Edited by - bl0498 on 24 Nov 2005 13:01:28 Edited to amend Pembrey Status Edited by - bl0498 on 24 Nov 2005 21:40:25 Edited to add Class 1 overbore allowance Edited by - bl0498 on 24 Nov 2005 21:44:27 Edited to amend Loton Pk Status Edited by - bl0498 on 25 Nov 2005 00:49:44 Edited to amend Harewood status Edited by - bl0498 on 28 Nov 2005 14:04:35 Edited to amend Shelsley Walsh status Edited by - bl0498 on 2 Dec 2005 20:09:15 Edited to ensure MIRA provisional date is actually a Saturday! Edited by - bl0498 on 3 Dec 2005 23:35:05 Edited to amend the Longcross 2 date Edited by - bl0498 on 6 Dec 2005 20:19:42 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Bees Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Why is it being considered that a reverse gear be mandatory for class 6 (other than as a way to make life difficult for BEC devotees...)? Just curious. If I were building a bike-engined non-roadgoing car there's no way I'd faff about putting a reverse gear in it. Or is it an MSA thing? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Brian Many thanks for your summary The only omission relates to the Chamionship were the additional points, up to 0.5, gained for breaking the Class record will be added to the points for the position e.g. 25 plus up to 0.5. Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Mike There are discussions with the MSA but this is to not the time or the place to elaborate any further. Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardO Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Pembrey? Time to break out the waterproofs.......yes, even in June Nice track though. Looks like a good calendar for next year; and running at Longcross twice is very welcome!(though 9th of July is a Sunday, not a Saturday ) My thanks to Mark et al 😬 R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Robinson Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Done Pembrey on a GSXR 600 twice and once in a 7 and all 3 times there was standing water at the hairpin even though it hadn't rained for a few days. Should be a laugh 😬 Good outcome from the forum chaps. Nice one Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmar Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 did the main championship also include something about number of records beaten in case of a tie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Bees Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Ok Mark. Just realised it can't be a Blue Book thing, none of the bike-engined single seaters have reverse (and I'm guessing the big 'uns don't either). Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Kipper Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Class 2 "K16 head porting retaining standard valves" Mr Andrews is going to be busy. Please form an orderly queue 😬 No pushing at the back 😬 Kipper Fun is not a straight line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Perry Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Anyone want a cheap class 2 crossflow ? 😳 😬 Thanks for everyones efforts on this Edited by - Graham Perry on 24 Nov 2005 13:14:25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Erm, Class 3 - 1800 k-series - VVC plenum-chambers not allowed... How does this sit with the 140bhp X-power (or SS) std. engines - they have (cosmetically at least) the same alloy plenum as the VVCs... Project Scope-Creep is live... Alcester Racing 7's Equipe - 🙆🏻™ Alcester-Racing-Sevens.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom7 Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 The benefit of a vvc plenum on a 1.8 is not as great as the benefit of a full port job on a 1.6 which could be making 170bhp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Sure, but if you were upgrading/building a 'standard' or SS 1.8, why couldn't you use the alloy plenum given that the X-Powers have it as standard? Project Scope-Creep is live... Alcester Racing 7's Equipe - 🙆🏻™ Alcester-Racing-Sevens.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Myles If a competitors K is fitted with the manufacturers ally plenium that is fine and the last time I looked the VVC plenium is significantly different and requires a different engine mount to fit under the bonnet that is unless you take a grinder to it. Tom You will not get 170bhp from a 1.6K using standard valves, Supersport cams and the MEMS ECU. Speed trap data from MIRA and Curborough have indicated that a ported 1.6K and a standard 1.8SS are very evenly matched. Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 I forgot to add that There will be a general 'spirit of regulations' regulation to reclassify cars if necessary. So if anyone is foolish enough to flout the spirit of the regulations they could find themselves being reclassified to either Class 4 or 5. As we have speed trap data at a number of events detection will not be too difficult but knowing the good nature of club members I do not expect this regulation to be used Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom7 Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Mark, Sorry, I wasn't looking for a row about class 2/3 regs as I have no axe to grind and will continue to compete (as well as I can) in class 5. It had just occurred to me as an observer that the balance seemed to favour those with a 1.6. But as you say, the speed trap data will be a good comparitor. I think competitiveness (straight line speed at least) in these classes for the 1.6 boys could be down to whether you have your head ported just as speed round the bends in class 5 can be down to whether you have sprint ACB10's. Still, roll on next year as Ive finished 4th in class 😬 twice now, although I was further away from the 3rd place man this year ☹️ Edited by - tom7 on 24 Nov 2005 17:18:57 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmar Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Tom - we have seen quite consistently over the last few years that 1800's have a 4-5 mph advantage through the speed traps when compared to unmodified 1600's running the same type of tyres (sticky acb's), however 1600's with ported heads are generally doing the same sorts of speeds... if at the end of the year it is found that modded 1600's are 4-5 mph faster than the unmodded 1800's through the speedtraps then I think measures will be brought up to make things equal again... rob PS I know what you mean finishing 4th in class as I have managed that for the last 2 years also ☹️ Edited by - robmar on 24 Nov 2005 17:34:08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mav Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Looks like if I go ahead and fit the Emerald, I'd be pushed to class 4 or 5??? The regulations also seem a little ambiguous re the fitment of verniers - do the class 2 / 3 cars have to have the std rover verniers fittes, or are the adjustable Items such as the piper items allowed? So I doubt you will see me competing in any club events, or any other come to that, if my winter plans come through... And before anyone says I should have been at the Tech forum, I couldn't as I had other commitments that weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Tom I'm sure you were not looking for a row but as it is the 'upgrade season' I need to spell it out loud and clear so that people do not spend money only to be disappointed to find themselves being moved up a Class. At the Tech Forum this topic was discussed in some detail including the justification for the changes. Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 do the class 2 / 3 cars have to have the std rover verniers fittes, or are the adjustable Items such as the piper items allowed Um, if it ain't adjustable, it won't need a vernier-scale... 'std rover pulleys' makes more sense... Project Scope-Creep is live... Alcester Racing 7's Equipe - 🙆🏻™ Alcester-Racing-Sevens.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Mav Vernier pulleys are permitted as they allow for the cams to be timed to the manufacturers specification whereas the standard Rover items are fixed and therefore the timing varies from car to car. The choice of fitment is up to the owner. Reprogrammable ECU's are not permitted in classes 2 & 3 as we do not want people building 170bhp+ cars to compete in these classes. I assume your winter plans do not relate to your 7 Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mav Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Winter plans were for the 7, and either A) fit the emerald to my std 1.6K SS + exhaust B) build a 1.8SS with Emerald so either way, if either of these plans come off, then I'll no longer be competing, as a 1.6 or 1.8 STANDARD SS (with emerald) will not be competative in the slightest in class 4 or 5 (not that I was super competative in Class 2). Um, if it ain't adjustable, it won't need a vernier-scale... 'std rover pulleys' makes more sense... Pedant - you knew what I meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Mav Why not save the money on Emerald and use the Supersport ECU Mark D Su77on Se7ens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Robinson Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Mav - you may not be competitive but you could still come along and enjoy yourself. Let's face it, if you stayed in class 3 with an 1800 supersport and came 6th (for sake of argument)then you have little excuse for not winning except your driving. If you move to class 5 and come 22nd you can at least claim you would have won if you had the same power as the top boys! I still swear blind I'd be formula one world champion if I wasn't eplieptic and banned by the MSA from racing in anything other than sprints. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mav Posted November 24, 2005 Share Posted November 24, 2005 Emerald has been sat on the shelf pending the winter upgrades. Steve - I know what you are saying, but to turn up and finish last or nearly last is really not my idea of fun. I understand the need to restrict the modifications to stop '170bhp' cars on a plenum, but this is possibly not the best way to do it, IMO. The rules are the rules, and If I am to compete then I'll have to fit in with them. I think it is unlikely I'll be competing though. ☹️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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