AMMO Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 I am seriously thinking of buying a car fitted with a BDG. I want the car for the chassis only and would like to sell the whole engine installation. The BDG in question is a 2.1 litre built by Wilcox. It has not been run since it has been built. It is 235 bhp spec with soft cams for road and track use. Needs hotter cams to liberate more power apparently. The engine is on carbs and will come with all the necessary components for the installation. Included is a custom made exhaust system with two alternative silencers. The cost of the engine and ancillaries is in the region of £20.000.00. Asking price is £15,000.00. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Ally block? Is it a brand new Wilcox motor or freshly rebuilt by Wilcox? No longer after a 3.14 diff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Is it based on a genuine FORD block, and if so is it a 4 bolt ot 2 bolt crank cap? Does it have the 'T' water pump? Is it a three bolt head stud ? Is it a 10MM plug or a 13MM version. Watch This Space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheds Moderator Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Is that an African or European swallow? 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
se7enmad Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Peter T, Werent you saying a couple of days ago they were all the same? 😬 😬 Antonella 1998 Caterham Classic my site heremore photos here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 The engine is original cast block not an aftermarket. It is obviously re-built rather than new. Apparently the cam carriers are also original. I will find out about the plugs and other bits. I'll probably go and take some photos next week AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 It is obviously re-built rather than new Why obviously? You can get newones. Surrounded by steel tubes and empty beer bottles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Antonella,design i meant dear boy!! 😬 So it is a refreshed unit then? If it is really a good unit it should have a history file of where it has been and who built it and supplied it new. As if it has no history to back up it's past, it could well have been a Bastardised unit that is worth a fraction of a genuine pedigree unit. Watch This Space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 Adam I'm not sure that new cast iron blocks are available. I thought only aluminium blocks are avaiable new. Hence my assumption that if its cast iron and the fact that it is bored to 2.1 litres that it is an original engine that has been re-bored / re-built. Bear with me as I gather more information on this particular engine. I do not pretend to be an expert on BD's. There are people on this forum that know a lot more about BD's than I ever will. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithj41 Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Peter T ------------------------------------------ Antonella,design i meant dear boy!! ------------------------------------------ Antonella is a female! (In case you don't know) James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry.h Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Ammo, If you want to know all about it you could give John Wilcox a call. Catch him on a good day and you'll find out all you ever wanted to know about everything and more!! Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 Barry I will probably give Wilcox a call once I have had a chance to look at the engine and get some more history. Edited by - AMMO on 21 Jan 2005 17:26:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Ammo: When I was thinking about putting a BDG back in mine, I talked to a lot of people about them and it was apparent that there are quite a few modifications on new parts. They're often very subtle but can potentially make a significant difference to reliability. For example, the old cam carriers used to crack in a certain place. I know some of the new cam carriers have had this weakness designed out. There are other bits as well but I forget what they are..... Burtons seemed very knowledgeable about BDGs so it may be worth asking them. You should at least get an unbiased opinion and be sure you know what you're getting. IMO there's a significant difference between a fresh motor made from old bits and a fresh motor made from new bits - especially if the old bits have been lifed off highly stressed race engines and put in a detuned motor in the hope they will be OK for the road. I'm sure you realise all this anyway - I just thought I'd mention it in the off-chance you weren't aware of all the dodgyness that goes on with these motors. I certainly wasn't and it was one of the things that put me off getting one. Surrounded by steel tubes and empty beer bottles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 22, 2005 Author Share Posted January 22, 2005 I understand that buying something like this can be a minefield. People who want one of these engines at the sort of price we are talking about want it to be 100% correct. Rightly so. The engine was purchased by my friend from Brian Burton of Burton's fame. It was an engine that had been built for Brian allegedly by Wilcox. My friend thinks that it may be a coincidence that it was another engine builder in Essex who also happens to be called Wilcox. I have sent an email to my friend who will quiz Brian (now retired from Burtons) for more info. My friend is also an engine tuner and has been a supplier of mine for around fifteen years. He would not sell me a dud and would not buy something for his own use if it was not right. I'm planning on going to see him next week and go through the file that accompanies the car. Apparently there are £20.000.00 worth of bills before the BDG went in! I'm quite enjoying researching this engine and if I could afford it I would probably keep it. Selling it is a way for me to get quite a high spec rolling chassis for a track day car for my second mid-life crisis 😬 Adam Out of curiosity, what di you put in your car in the end rather than a BDG? AMMO Edited by - AMMO on 22 Jan 2005 07:57:27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebubs Posted January 22, 2005 Share Posted January 22, 2005 Isn't John Wilcox in Leicestershire, not Essex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted January 22, 2005 Share Posted January 22, 2005 Adam has gone BUSA power. 😬 Watch This Space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 22, 2005 Author Share Posted January 22, 2005 Stevebubs That's what I'm saying. Not John Wilcox in Leicestershire but another Wilcox in Essex. More info to follow. Peter Suzuki Hiabusa 😬 😬 Must be a laugh. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter T Posted January 22, 2005 Share Posted January 22, 2005 Yes i think he also wants a TURBO, no point in putting a LOW powered engine in there!!! 😳 Watch This Space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 23, 2005 Author Share Posted January 23, 2005 The thought of it makes me grin Did you see the TTS stand in the constructors pavillion at the Autosport show? The had a supercharged Hiabusa with a crank driven Rotrex charger and the intercooler that bolted straight to the induction sytem. Looked really neat. 250 bhp with 7 psi or over 300 bhp with 14 psi. They also used the same type of charger on a Civic. Basically looks like a turbo but is belt driven on the Honda. I've known Richard Alban of TTS of years. Had a good chat about grafting one of these chargers to a Duratec. Smaller than an Eaton but requires an oil supply whilst the Eaton has its own sump. The Rotrex is £1600.00 on its own or £4,500.00 for a complete conversion for the Busa. Shouldn't this be on Tech Talk? Back to the original subject. Does anybody want a complete BDG installation subject to finding out its complete history? AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 Here's one of Richard's creations.....It's a direct drive Rotrex SC Westfield with twin stage Nitros oxide The Rotrex is much more efficient that other SC designs and is very small. It's basically a mechanically driven turbo. Back OT - have you put an advert on Racecar or similar? You may find one of the historic race/rally folk are after a BDG. Surrounded by steel tubes and empty beer bottles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edmandsd Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I saw this Westfield at Santa Pod last year. Slower terminals than me although the guy's quoting c 200 bhp more than my 270 bhp *confused* blew it up at the end of the day..... Home of HTR700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 24, 2005 Author Share Posted January 24, 2005 Adam The reason it is advertised here first is that it is a complete Caterham installation. I would end up with redundant bits suited to this engine that a rally / historic guys aren't interested in. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 AMMO - I hope someone does take you up on your offer and put the motor in a Caterham. I have some vids of when my car used to have a BDG and it was awesome - phenomenol sound and extremely fast as a race car. There are a couple of Cats with BDGs but I am not aware of any being competed in any way, certainly not sprints/hills. Its a shame as a full on BDG would surely be very competitive and an auditory delight. edmandsd - Blew up eh????? Funny that wasn't mentioned when I was enquiring about getting a similar install. Surrounded by steel tubes and empty beer bottles.... Edited by - AdamHay on 24 Jan 2005 14:12:38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Bees Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 IIRC Clive Kenrick's non-roadgoing hillclimb Caterham was powered by a mechanically-injected alloy-blocked BDG. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irrelevant Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 Mike Bees: Was is the correct tense ☹️.....Dunno what has happened to his car now. I believe his current steed is a Mallock. Oh, and BTT as I hope someone buys this for a Caterham Surrounded by steel tubes and empty beer bottles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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