3d mapped Xflows

[Violet Elizabeth]

Morning,

 

I was wondering if anyone has a view on whether adding one of them fancy 3d ignitions to my xflow will help it start. I have a new battery which is kept fully charged with an optimate, but it still never seems to start that well.

 

N.

[Casbar]

Bad starting can be caused by many things. 3d mapped ignitions cost a fortune, but they may not sort out your starting problem. Dave Andrews has some good info on Mapped Ignition systems http://hometown.aol.com/dvandrews

 

My car used to struggle, then I changed the starter motor from the old type, with a seperate solenoid to a more modern one. Got the motor off of James Whitting, starts easily every time now, motor gives more power.

 

I suggest you give James a ring. X-flows sometimes have miss matched ring gear on the starter motors, especially if the motor isn't orginal. Ford and after market manufacturers make a variety of starter motors, that fit cross flows, but if the ring gear is wrong, it struggles to turn the engine over.

 

I also changed my electronic system for a Lucas competition system, which has a stronger spark. (Roger King can advise on that http://freespace.virgin.net/seven.workshop/

 

Rgds, Robert

 

 

[oilyhands]

Sometimes an engine with a lot of static advance can 'kick-back' when starting and cause excessive grief for the starter and the owner. One owner I know killed 3 starters running with 16 degrees BTDC.

 

Kick-back is characterised by the starter slowing as you crank as if the battery were flat. Its caused by the flame front hitting the piston before it has been cranked to TDC, the flame front then resists the starters attempts to continue rotation of the engine (and hence try to compress the ignited and therefore expanding mixture).

 

Mapped igntion allows you to run as much static advance / idle advance as you wish but provides a separate 'cranking advance' which is usually around 5-8 degrees that is used whenever you start the engine, this effectively prevents 'kick-back'. As soon as the engine fires up, the static/idle advance value from the map is then used.

 

Apart from all the other advantages of mapped igntion (improved flexibility, economy, recuction of stand-off, improvement of 'off-cam) it can extend your starters life.

 

If your starting is down to a mechanical problem or fuelling then mapped ignition will do little to help.

 

oily

[greg]

How much does such a 3d mapping cost, don't you need to put the car on a rolling road to mapp it ? (i.e cost of unit, plus labour, plus road ...)

[oilyhands]

An ECU costs between £350 and £600, some are ignition only and cant be upgraded to injection others can. You also need to either modify your distributor to lock the advance mechanism, or fit one with no advance curve. Most also require an electronic trigger rather than points so a lumenition eye or hall effect distrubutor is required. A throttle pot will also need fitting to the throttle spindle of your carb.

 

Quite often sample maps are available which will get you very close to optimum for your engine and allow you to run safely, but ultimately you will need an hour or so on a rolling road to perfect the map. IME the cost for a 16 load site map, given a starter map would be around £100 for a reasonable operator.

 

oily

[greg]

So not cheap then ...

 

I've obviously developed upgradits, and I've only had the car a week (well Paul Harvey has ... as the starter gave up!).

 

I wondering what I should do next, as the car has a nice engine, gearbox, diff, suspension. Dry sumping seems to be as expensive..... But I'll probably need a new set of tryes soon anyway !

 

So a toss up between map ignition or Dry-sumping ...

 

Q 990 RAE

[Tony]

I had the Webber-Alpha mapped ignition system fitted to my 1600 Xflow by Chris Wheeler at the 7 Workshop. At the same time, I had some work done by Roger King (who works out of the same place) including fitting hardened valve seats for unleaded petrol, also gas-flowing the head and fitting formula Ford valve springs. I didn't have the car rolling-roaded afterwards as I felt it was quite a brutal thing to do to the engine, but I can tell you the whole package of alterations has made a major improvement. There is definitely more power, but most impressive is the way the power is delivered. The engine feels much freer, wanting to rev and rev easier, power is better and smoother at all stages of the rev band. Spitting and popping from the carbs is a thing of the past. Fuel consumption (on a run) can get up to around 27mpg (not if you get enthusiastic though). The engine feels 'fatter' somehow, like it has been taken out, left to soak in cream, and refitted. I like to think this is the way Caterham might have developed the car, if the Xflow had continued.

I also reccommend Chris Wheeler and Roger King at the 7 Workshop. Very friendly, excellent advice and a really clean professional job, plus if you want to climb past 150bhp with your Xflow they can do it all for you.