Red Line Components Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 1999 1.8 K Series SSport - Standard front brakes fitted, will need to replace the pads soon..what is best for daily road use plus 4 or 5 track days /year...and where can I get them from (Hertfordshire area) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 Try the EBC Grenstuff pads available from James Whiting. I changed over to these a few weeks ago and the brakes are a definite improvement in terms of pedal feel and, of course, stopping power. Brent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 Might be worth looking at red stuff for the track days. Not very good for road use as they require heating up before they work properly, but they are even more resistant to brake fade and retain almost as much stopping power as green stuff (from sales literature). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewartG Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 Minty, I think I've got a set of hardly used EBC greenstuffs that you could try, they're somewhere in the garage god knows where. I could try and find them if you're interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFA Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 I've just put Red Stuff in my AP barkes and can report no problems with them running too cool. They stop great on the road - have to see if they are up to the track....soon...... Arnie Webb The Fat Bloke blush.gif in a not so Slow Vauxhall wink.gif See the R500 eater here See the Le Mans Trip Website here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave M Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 I use Green Stuff pads. They are great on the road and do not fade on the track. I have done two track days and three supersprint meetings with them. They are great and NO BRAKE DUST! The agent told me the Greens were best for a road/track car that weighs <600kg. Dave PRB87 (AUS) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRIS CLARK Posted April 12, 2001 Share Posted April 12, 2001 I have just purchased some 'Green' EBC pads (not yet fitted) and the literature does say to use this compound for light weight cars. Red for heavier cars (V/X's ha ha) or track work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFA Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Chris, Red for cars which can hit 140mph plus on straights. Brakes which appear to work at well at lower speeds can perform erratically as the speed increases by relatievly small amounts. Vapour lock caused by an overheating pad/caliper was the sole reason for my massive rollover at Goodwood in '94 (140mph) Arnie Webb The Fat Bloke blush.gif in a not so Slow Vauxhall wink.gif See the R500 eater here See the Le Mans Trip Website here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewartG Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Arnie, is vapour lock different to air in the brakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirium Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 I've just put Pagid rs-42's on my live axle caterham. After trying Mindex and various other's I've found that the rs-42's are fantastic. They work from cold, but also go upto 800 degrees whereas Mindex start to run out at 400 and just glaze big time. No Glaze at all on the 42's even after several hard track days including hard braking circuits such as Cadwell. My brother-in-law has had the same pair of 42's on his for over a year and 9 track days - still fantastic and no glazing !! They are a tad expensive - £115 a set! Regards John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elie boone Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 How about RED DOT pads ? did somebody ever tried those pads ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul jacobs Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Interesting that you're using Red Stuff pads Arnie. The blurb on the spec. sheet specifically says that they are not a good idea on any road car. I've been using Green Stuff on my 21 [which weighs in at a hefty 750kgs in road trim], for the past 2 seasons, but have to say that frankly I'm disappointed with them. There really was no noticeable improvement over the standard pads supplied by Caterham, in their big brake kit, in addition, I had stacks of dust every time I did a bit of track work, mainly on the front and slightly less on the back, but I still ended up with blackened silver wheels. In addition I had problems with overheating fluid too. In an effort to sort a cure, I've now fitted a 13/16" master cylinder, and a set of 11" front rotors with grooves and vents. They look very sexy, but I hope that they actually work as well as they look. I may try a set of Red Stuff pads or even splash out on a set of those Pagids [which Jez recomended too incidentally] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul jacobs Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Interesting that you're using Red Stuff pads Arnie. The blurb on the spec. sheet specifically says that they are not a good idea on any road car. I've been using Green Stuff on my 21 [which weighs in at a hefty 750kgs in road trim], for the past 2 seasons, but have to say that frankly I'm disappointed with them. There really was no noticeable improvement over the standard pads supplied by Caterham, in their big brake kit, in addition, I had stacks of dust every time I did a bit of track work, mainly on the front and slightly less on the back, but I still ended up with blackened silver wheels. In addition I had problems with overheating fluid too. In an effort to sort a cure, I've now fitted a 13/16" master cylinder, and a set of 11" front rotors with grooves and vents. They look very sexy, but I hope that they actually work as well as they look. I may try a set of Red Stuff pads or even splash out on a set of those Pagids [which Jez recomended too incidentally] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul jacobs Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Oops, sorry for the double post, itchy trigger finger I'm afraid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asklepios Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Re.Vapour lock. Has this anything to do with the ability to resist brake fade that the green/red stuff debate concerns? Surely vapour lock is more to do with the brake fluid`s characteristics,especially the resistance to picking up moisture,which when heated by said brake/pad, produces vapour which being gaseous is compressable. Hence foot to boards and no response. The cure for vapour lock is racing fluid not racing pads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRIS CLARK Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 And change the fluid more often 'cos in our damp climate with the brake fluid being hygroscopic it can easily have that boil water/steam effect. The water is basically non compressible, but when heated to such a point that steam can be created then that IS compressible. Result:- pedal-to-floor syndrome thumbsdown.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul jacobs Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Am I right in assuming that the best way to change the fluid is to just bleed each caliper in turn then top up the m/c with fresh fluid? Is there any order for bleeding the callipers? ie furthest from the m/c first or vice versa? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFA Posted April 13, 2001 Share Posted April 13, 2001 Asklepios, You are correct, vapour lock is caused by the fluid overheating, but this is generally caused by the inability of the pads to convert the motion of the car to heat under braking and quickly dissapate it. Lower spec pad materials retain the heat longer and hence less stoppping power is required to cause them to return to an over temp condition and and consequently the fluid then increases in temperature further. All pads will stop your car, race grade pads have better dissipation properties and lower frictional properties to respectively provide less fade (actually normally the fluid not the pad)and greater durability. When the fluid overheats it becomes more compressible. Localised overheating will cause a single caliper to fail as it did in my case. Incidently, EBC reccommend Green Stuff only in road cars as a generallism. Red stuff does need to be driven mildly agressively in some cars to work at all. They told me Red Stuff would be OK after I told them I had been using Mintex 1166 on the road! (and it was Ok so long as I drove mildly agressively. Its difficult to drive my car any other way!) Arnie Webb The Fat Bloke blush.gif in a not so Slow Vauxhall wink.gif See the R500 eater here See the Le Mans Trip Website here Edited by - fat arnie on 13 Apr 2001 23:05:13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick M Posted April 14, 2001 Share Posted April 14, 2001 Paul, If you're getting lots of dust from Green Stuff pads then this could be an indication that they're getting to the upper edges of their temperature range. The literature they supply mentions this somewhere and I've seen evidence that this is the case on three cars, i.e. they started to cook the pads and the amount of dust they produced compared to normal running increased noticeably. Personally I find Green Stuff OK for the road but I'd now use Red Stuff for track days. There is even someone who uses Yellow Stuff pads on his W*******d race car as he found he was cooking Red Stuff pads over the course of a 10-15 lap race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewartG Posted April 14, 2001 Share Posted April 14, 2001 Minty, I've found the Greenstuff pads in the garage, I've even found the box they're hardly used. If you want to give them a try let me know, might see you at the next Hertford Heath or at Wareside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFA Posted April 14, 2001 Share Posted April 14, 2001 Tried my red Stuff's in the wet this morning. Amazingly progressive, not a hit of grab and lock! In the dry I seem to stop. Very quickly! Arnie Webb The Fat Bloke blush.gif in a not so Slow Vauxhall wink.gif See the R500 eater here See the Le Mans Trip Website here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgracing Posted April 17, 2001 Share Posted April 17, 2001 I changed to Red Stuff pads from the standard pads and was impressed by the feel both on the road and on track. I changed to Mintexx 1155s recently as I thought Red Stuff's were overdoing it a bit. However, the 1155s didn't have as much feel. I haven't tried Green Stuffs. Did I read somewhere that one of the EBC pad types was likely to warp discs ? DM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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