caterhamnut Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I have just replaced my inlet manifold gasket, which had been leaking. I undid the manifold - did not undo any pipes or leads except the breather pipes into the head. Replaced obviously deteriated old gasket, and put it all back together again. Did a quick visual check on the spark plugs whilst I was at it - all looked good. Re-filled coolant etc. Went to start car (which normally starts right away) - no joy - very lump firing, then nothing. Do I need to rest something? any ideas? New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 You could have possibly tripped the inertia/fuel cut off switch. Normaly fitted under bobbet - RHS of scuttle panel. It has a rubber top that you push in to reset. Worth a check Steve Se7en-Up! Honk if U flash! If you see a speed camera - HONK your horn to alert other road users they are aproaching an accident blackspot! Together we can make a difference 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Howe Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 Angus, there is nothing to reset. Could you have dislodged any wires, do you have spark? JH Deliveries by Saffron, the yellow 222bhp Sausage delivery machine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 Agree with Steve. When he and I were helping Kev Sull with his CRB change last week, the car wouldn't restart until Steve reset the fuel cut off switch on the front face of scuttle nearside of car. Brent Zetec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 24, 2003 Author Share Posted September 24, 2003 I shall check that, though I don't think I went anywhere near that. I am wondering if it could be anything to do with the temp sensor in the first inlet pipe - it was a bit cruddy (coolant had been leaking in it seems) and I gave it a bit of a wipe - could I have damaged that? Dr Peter C is on his way over - I'll let you know if we find anything! New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Plato Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 You should also check the leads to and from the coil - under the manifold , also check the sensor on the belhousing under the manifold - this is the crank position sensor . Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nifty Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 All spark plug leads firmly reattached to the correct cylinder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 24, 2003 Author Share Posted September 24, 2003 Bloody marvelous. We now have one car that won't start (7) and one car that won't stop (Volvo - see other thread!) 😬 *confused* New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Day Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 Thottle pot sensor?? Has the lead come off?? Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F355GTS Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 Plug leads or HT lead/ low tension to the coil (just under the inlet manifold) Wire to crank sensor rear of r/h side of engine Wire to IACV or the IACV itself sticking Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 24, 2003 Author Share Posted September 24, 2003 all of the above!?! Peter spent a good few hours helping us on this - many thanks as usual Peter! Combination of a few things no doubt. That miss we had due to - or rather as shown by - the MFU - well, it never really went away, or at least it came back. New MFU from caterham made little if no difference. Checked earths - one was possibly a bit iffy, so we cleaned that up. There is certainly an issue with the IAVC/air flow. We gave it a *quick* clean - it was pretty sooty. Hopefully Peter will see this and give a more technical summing up of what we found/think it could be, but it seems to be swallowing too much air at idle, and is rather difficult to start (all was fine until I took the bloody manifold off to replace the gasket ) It seems that there was almost certainly an issue with the low tension leads to the coil. Whilst it was idling, I fiddled with these and the engine stopped - we had a look and found pretty dirty connections (car used in all conditions/all year) so we cleaned these up. I am sure these would have been moved/knocked when I took off the inlet manifold. It could be that electrical 'blips' 'spikes' 'inteferance' from this could have caused problems. We seemed to have to reset the ECU and immobiliser each time during initial tests, so maybe something was causing the ECU to reset, or cutting its power supply - the dodgy earth? As it stands now, we can just about get the car started, with careful playing with the throttle, whilst playinga finger over the hole in the top of the throttle body that leads to the IVAC (air filter removed) Once the car has lumpily started it then settles into a pretty good idle - still with the odd miss accompanied with the click from the MFU. We checked all hoses/wires - no obvious air leaks anywhere around the inlet manifold. Discovered a few things about the car though - its an early 1.6 supersport - so a lot of the components are from a 1.4 k series - such as the flywheel - which means the second hand one I got to replace our starter motor damaged one is not right but does mean that I could purchase a light weight 1.4 version from caterham for a lot less than a lightweight 1.6 flywheel (all to do with number of teeth in the flywheel as recognised by the crank sensor) The thing is with our car is that as an only car which we rely on all year round, it has never been off the road - it does not have 3 month breaks 'over winter' when it is in the garage, stripped, cleaned etc etc. It needs this at some point - just to have a good look, learn about it etc etc. Hell - at least now we have the borrowed Volvo...except that doesn't STOP when we turn the key off and walk away... 😬 New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 hi angus, couple of comments for the record in case someone comes up with similar symptoms. The *miss* was caused by the MFU momentarily stopping the fuel pump. Two relays in the MFU were triggering (the fuel pump and the lambda heater circuit). Both of these are controlled by the ECU, so there is a chance of the ECU glitching and causing this. Both are also cascaded from the output of the main relay, so any compromise of the feed from the main relay would cause both to glitch - this could be caused by a bad connection from the ignition switch or suchlike. The fact that it reset as soon as the relays triggered is a bit suspicious and points back to the possibility of bad earths. The earth we cleaned up by attaching it direct to the battery. There is probably some value in cleanign up the earth strap from the chassis to the engine as well. The IACV is a right pain. It didn't seem keen to close off enough. I think the IACV is controlled by relative position (stepper motor), so it probably isn't getting to the right position during the reset sequence. The flywheel suggestion is pure speculation at the moment. The crank sensor is definitely of the old type and didn't trigger the Emerald ECU which was expecting to see the weird Rover 4 tooth missing pattern. You will have to examine the existing flywheel to determine that it really is a 1.4 pattern flywheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 25, 2003 Author Share Posted September 25, 2003 Thanks for clarifying stuff - thought I had most of it, but we looked at so many possibilites! 😬 New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F355GTS Posted September 25, 2003 Share Posted September 25, 2003 Angus/Peter is the car now running an Emerald? Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted September 25, 2003 Share Posted September 25, 2003 No. The car is still on a MEMS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 25, 2003 Author Share Posted September 25, 2003 ok my faithful band of helpers ! - the sage continues. Thought I had when I had got the car idling, pretty smoothly once warm. Touched/moved the HT lead into the coil - it stopped. Hurray - dodgy lead. Down to Halfords, bought a new HT lead (those orange ones they sell singularly) and some new spark plugs whilst I was at it. Fitted it all - still a real nightmare to start. Seemed to try and fire for the first 2-3 seconds of turning the key, then just turn over with no attempt at firing. Eventually got it started - tried to flex/bend/move every wire seperatly that runs under the manifold, crank sensors etc etc Only when I Pulled the NEW HT lead slightly did the engine miss and then stop. Sooooo - could the coil be knackered? Can it be tested? Seems to have trouble starting, but ok once running? Incidently - the clicking noise fromthe MFU seems to have stopped (for now no doubt) once the car is idling, I am wondering if that was the dodgy earth Peter may have fixed, and is sorted, but maybe all the blips and peaks of dodgy electrics has knackered the coil? Is there anything left on this car to try?! 😬 New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F355GTS Posted September 25, 2003 Share Posted September 25, 2003 Angus the coils are fairly robust, again you can borrow mine if you want to eliminate it just park the Volvo up the road, don't want the neighbours thinking I know poor people 😬 😬 😬 Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 25, 2003 Author Share Posted September 25, 2003 B*stard 😬 Anyway - if I park it up the road it will only drive itself down after me. Perhaps just a cr*p quality lead? New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caterhamnut Posted September 25, 2003 Author Share Posted September 25, 2003 does the k-series coil need earthing - or rather does it need to be bolted to the block to test, or can I simply remove the leads, pop them on Marks which I have borrowed, and try it like that? New site! mycaterham.com here 50,000miles in 2 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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