Support Team Shaun_E Posted July 30, 2003 Support Team Share Posted July 30, 2003 Will be fitting a new (aluminium) radiator this weekend so need to know what the best coolant to use is. K series engine, used on road and track. Prefer that it is something that I can get rom Halfords or local Rover dealer. Cheers, Shaun Yellow SL #32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevefoster Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Comma Coldstream ready mixed antifreeze/coolant. Contains mono propylene gycol. ~£9.99 for 5l from any good motor factor that do Comma Speedy Steve's Workshop here Hants (North) and Berkshire Area club site here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Support Team Shaun_E Posted July 30, 2003 Author Support Team Share Posted July 30, 2003 Cheer's Steve. Yellow SL #32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bare Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Suggest : Honda Coolant.. reputedly absolutely excellent for Ali engines.. Dunno if it's Available in the UK tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickW Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 What about flushing the system out before putting the new stuff in? Advisable? Best way to do it? Regards, Nick. 1990 Xflow & flares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAVID L Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Can I steal thread....when I bought my VX tuned, alli rad, jobbie earlier this year it "passed" water everywhere. This was probably just the normal VX airlocks and I have had no probs since. It is now filled with standard H2O. First, if and whenI use an additive, will this find the leaks again and second, recomendations for aforesaid additive? DAVID L 7-UPMANSHIP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan L Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Shaun, if you want Coldstream but having difficulty getting hold of it let me know. Middx Tuning Centre in South Harrow do it (about 5 mins from me) and if they are out I should have enough (8 & 1/2 litres) of the ready mix in my garage to do you. I've got to work Saturday starting about midday so to diverting in your direction would not be a problem. It was just over a tenner for 5 litres of ready mix. Alan and his Yellow and Green BDR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevefoster Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I get my Coldstream from RoadPower in Kanpphill, Woking. Just around the corner from me. He does have to order it but gets it delivered same day... If you let me know in time and you want to come to the Hants (north) and Berks meet tomorrow night I could pick some up for you... Speedy Steve's Workshop here Hants (North) and Berkshire Area club site here Edited by - stevefoster on 30 Jul 2003 21:46:51 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simos Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 David L, you need an additive to stop nasty corrosive reactions inside the block, h2o only is a bad thing for engines with a mixture of ali and iron ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 The search facility is down, so I can't find where I did this thoroughly last time. Short cut asnwer was... ... you can use a trad formulation coolant ethylene glycol + additives {typically silicates for aluminium protection, but non-silicate and low-slicate formulations exist - notably from Jap manufacturers}, 50% solution with deionised water but you *must* change it every 12 months. With an aluminium radiator you can use an ethylene glycol coolant with an OAT additive package which should be good for 3 years minimum, but must only be topped up with the same mix. If you have a copper radiator you *must not* use an OAT coolant. There are hybrids of trad and OAT that you can also get. You can also use Comma coldstream which is a Propylene Glycol based coolant with an OAT additive package. The PG is not classed as a hazardous material, won't kill your pet cat if you spill it and doesn't spell instant death for your bearings if you happen to contaminate your oil with it. PG is not so good at low temperatures because it gets very viscous. Manufacturers recommendations come about because of the particular metallurgy and choice of materials in the engine. Not all casting alumminium alloys are the same, so a Honda engine can have different coolant requirements to a Rover engine. In partcular the silicon level in certain k-series castings has been quite low. Understanding this it is clear that there is no measurable scale of "quality" of coolant with Honda at one end and Rover at the other. Finally... WATER is a corrosive agent. The glycols are added to lower the freezing point. The additives are there to take away the corrosive properties of the water. Running with just water is an engine-busting disaster. Also the coolant degrades and bcomes contaminated with combustion byproducts. These turn your coolant acidic and that really starts eating your engine. Additives counter the effects of acid contamination. The water is just very effective at carrying heat. Coolant packages also change the surface tension properties and reduce the tendency for cavitation (hot surface and in the water pump). Running with just WATER is dissolving your engine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Support Team Shaun_E Posted July 31, 2003 Author Support Team Share Posted July 31, 2003 Al - cheers mate, if I can't get any today I'll give you a bell. Steve - thanks for the offer, but I can't get to the Phoenix tonight ☹️ Peter - thanks once again for explaining this - I asked you the same questions at the get to know your seven day but I have a head like a sieve and at the time we discussed it I had the std black radiator so I believe the answer may have been slightly different. As I don't know what coolant is in there right now (Caterham would have put the last stuff in) I guess I need to flush the system out before refilling. Any recommedations on how best to do that. Thanks everyone. Shaun Yellow SL #32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Support Team Shaun_E Posted July 31, 2003 Author Support Team Share Posted July 31, 2003 Al/Steve, Managed to get some Coldstream at Cafco in Slough . I had a alook at the Comma site and found the following information: Comma Coldstream is Propylene Glycol. XStream Red is ethylene glycol with OAT additives. Xstream Green is ethylene glycol with additives that are nitrite, amine & phosphate free. Caterham build manual recommends XStream red and specifically mentions OAT - sounds like this is the best solution but is more expensive than Coldstream. Cheers, Shaun Yellow SL #32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Just to add a bit of info. Coldstream is advertised as using the BASF Trigard package. This turns out to be an OAT additives package as well. Be careful how you dispose of used coolant. Ideally take it to a friendly and environmentally responsible garage which has appropriate collection arrangements. It is hideously poisonous stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul-R Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 Peter Re. your comment on NOT using OAP on copper rads, I am currently using Rover 5 year OAP on the older style rad! What damage can this do and what alternative is best (not Coldstream either it would appear). Assume a quick change is recommended. Any advise gratefully received. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 The problem with the OATs is to do with the construction technique of the rad rather than the copper itself. If the rad is soft solder constructed, any remaining flux is taken up by the coolant and becomes highly acidic. When OATs first started appearing, all sorts of engine components were redesigned (usually using aluminium alloys) to avoid such problems. A traditional ethylene glycol silicates and other stuff suitable for aluminium engines is fine, but *must* be changed before it deteriorates. Many things can destabilise the additives package. For example, overheating because of a failed rad fan temp switch; contamination with combustion byproducts; running with a hotspot caused by an airlock; gradual contamination giving the coolant a safe working life of 12 months. If the coolant destabilises it will deposit silica gel (which can only be removed with a caustic flush - not possible with aluminium engines) in the coolant passageways and it might cause a water pump seal failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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