Leadership Team Mcalvert Posted July 24, 2003 Leadership Team Share Posted July 24, 2003 Having blown two alternators recently, I want to try to prevent this appening again. The car is a 1700 Xflow, and both failures happend after prolonged high-speed and high revs running (first at Cadwell track day, second when taking passengers on fast road trips in Bordeaux). I have checked the earth connections and these seem good. My assumptions therefore are that the failures can only be due to 1) excessive heat, 2) excessive speed or 3) excessive vibrations. Therefore, I plan to: 1) Lag the exhause manifolds - I remember a thread recently about the best source for lagging but without the search option, cannot find this. Can someone please point me towards the best supplier? 2) Fit a larger pulley on the alternator to reduce its speed. However, I am having problems finding a source - does anyone have any ideas? 3) Not sure about reducing vibrations - can anything be done here? Oh, and 4) I'll get a spare to carry to carry with me to track days. Is this a Halfords job or is there somewhere that will sell me an alternator cheaper? Thanks for your help, Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger King Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Michael, Wilcox sell a nylon alternator adjusting bar to replace the steel one. This can be quite effective at vibration reduction. They also allegedly sell a rubber mounted bracket for the cylinder block, but every time we've tried to get one they've been out of stock. If it make you feel any better, the problem is common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team Mcalvert Posted July 24, 2003 Author Leadership Team Share Posted July 24, 2003 Thanks Roger - that's a good pointer - Do you have any contact details please? Thanks - Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Michael, I think you can get the bigger diameter pulleys from Brise (01322-277622) or possibly even Burtons. Alternatively Raceline, in Surrey, did stock them in the past but don't know if they still do. I know it cost you an alternator, and I have mentioned it before, but watching you arrive in front of me at Montignac and, better still, watching the face of your passenger was the highlight of my trip . All I can say is....Don't stop what you are doing, it is hugely entertaining ❗ 😬 Forgot to say that Raceline also do the nylon strap Roger spoke of. I know 'cos I bought one from them for my car. Brent Edited by - BRENT CHISWICK on 24 Jul 2003 15:06:16 Edited by - BRENT CHISWICK on 24 Jul 2003 15:23:24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Dont Burtons sell blokes clothes? GO to a local auto electrian - when my K series alt died, I got a Halfords exhange unit for about £70 or 80, only to find out a week later a local auto sparky could have done an exchange unit for £40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 You need to check the charging feed to the battery as well as earths. If you have a master switch, this can become unreliable in as little as 12 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 I went through 5 alternators in about 6 weeks. The problem was later diagnosed by a local auto electrical guy as poor quality recon units supplied by a local factors!. He took my faulty unit away and repaired it / rebuilt it. He charged me £40.00 in total. This included fitting. He also said that a Caterham spec crossflow would not be able to overspin a standard alternator as they (the alternators) are very over rated for this particular application. He said that if a diode was going to fail - chances are it would be when it is working the hardest - at high revs. This normally leads to an uneccesary upgrade of the alternator pulley. His recomendations were as follows- Reduce underbonnet temps by wrapping exhaust primaries - DONE Fit a nylon strap to reduce vibration from the engine - DONE Fit nyloc nuts to the alternator mounting bracket to stop the nuts vibrating loose - DONE So far this has done the trick and the alternator has been rock solid! Steve Se7en-Up! Less is more! Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Steve, you certainly like to tempt fate 😬 Michael, it is a very good point that Steve makes as, having been alongside him at the traffic lights sprint, I can assure you he doesn't spare the horses either so if his alternators are now up to the job then yours should be ok with a few precautions. Brent Edited by - BRENT CHISWICK on 24 Jul 2003 15:45:29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 S0ds law says it will fall off now and take out my axle on the way out from under the car 😬 Steve Se7en-Up! Less is more! Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 Steve, Good job I had my engine upgrade then as I can now make certain I am in front of you when it does fall off 😬 Errr...better warn Den (Only joking Den, if you are reading this.....If not then I meant every word 😬) Brent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted July 24, 2003 Share Posted July 24, 2003 😬 😬 😬 Steve Se7en-Up! Less is more! Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team Mcalvert Posted July 24, 2003 Author Leadership Team Share Posted July 24, 2003 Thanks all for the input I forgot to thank Peter for taking my call on a Saturday afternoon from France and helping guide me towards the root cause (as I wasn't convinced that the alternator was at fault this time). I will re-check the live feed, thanks for the reminder. So - lagging the pipes seems to be a must - any supplier recommendations? I'll also go for the nylon bracket as that seems a good precaution. Are alternators rated for a particular maximum speed? I'd like to work out what speed mine would be spinning at with its current gearing with the engine hitting the red-line at 7,300 and see how much inside or outside of the maximum this is. Thanks again, Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strongy Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 I lagged my zorst recently and required 50m of wrap do cover the 4 primaries (2 & 3 wrapped as one). I got the wrap from a company called proven products - if you cant find it on the net give me a shout and i'll find the invoice details. Since wrapping the alternator has been great 1000 miles with no red light flickering! Strongy - go on, let the neighbours sleep 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 Proven Products are here *thumbup* Steve Se7en-Up! Less is more! Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team Mcalvert Posted July 26, 2003 Author Leadership Team Share Posted July 26, 2003 Thanks All - Exhaust wrap ordered and I'll let you know how I get on. As recommended by Roger King, Wilcox does manufacture a nylon Alternator arm - picture here for those who are interested: http://www.wilcoxengines.demon.co.uk/bda_parts.htm I just need to work out exactly what I need - is it just the arm, or also the stud? Regards - Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg Posted July 26, 2003 Share Posted July 26, 2003 Are you talking about the bolt that holds the bar+cover on - always usefull to have some spares, and do not do them up too tight! Greg, Q 86 NTM (Green 185BHP XF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YW Sin Posted July 26, 2003 Share Posted July 26, 2003 Why add all that extra bits and pieces when you can get alternators that won't break at the first place? Ditch that bad-old Lucas alternators and get hold of one of those Jap Denso stuff. I believe they are off the Japanese K cars which are small and light. I know that Japanese Seven owners does that but I have no idea how can I get hold of them in Europe. (Aparently the first thing they do when their car arrives from UK) Touch wood, I have had no alternator problem till now, but if it does go wrong, I know what not to do. Replace it with the same model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Haighton Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Another way of preventing heating of the alternator on a x-flow is to put at heat shield between alternator and exhaust. I've bent 'Aerotech' insulation sheeting (see Merlins catalogue) in to a part-box shape . At the top it's bolted to a spare mounting point on the side of the engine above the alternator, and at the bottom to one of the alternator bracket mounting points. Seems to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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