1400 SuperSport Liners

[tony isherwood]

To increase the power/rev range of a 1400SS (apart dropping a 1600 lump in) is possible to increase the rev range? From previous posts, I understand that there is a danger of the liners moving. However I have one of the (un)lucky 1400 engines where the liners can not be replaced with 1600 liners in the block.

 

Question are , If my liners are firmly wedged in

1) Can they removed for repair (might be a silly question but I will ask it any how)

2) If they are not removable, how safe is it to increase the rev trange, by how much and would the effort be worth while ?

I assume that @ some stage, the 1400 valve sizes cause breathing problems even if I can get more air / fuel using throttle bodies.

(May be just blast it in using a turbo, or Supercharger ?)

Rgds Tony Ish

(Hearing the stories of Mike Days 1400 to 1600 conversion is enough to put anyone of that route of upgrade ;O)

 

[murph7355]

Am not sure whether your liners can be repaired (Mike Bees may know) but I understand you can get more power out of the 1400 with std. liners (which should be OK to around 8k revs, but as with all things engine the stronger the bits, the more likely you are to get some longevity).

 

Work to do would be (in no particular order):

 

- change of exhaust (if you don't have a 4-2-1 etc. with longer primaries). If you can bin the cat', so much the better.

- new cams and ECU. Piper do a wide range for the 'k'. I'm not sure which are best for the 1400 (no. 270s spring to mind. I have 740s on my 1800) but Warren at Piper would be able to advise. Emerald or MBE ecu would be the way to go, the latter being a bit cheaper from what I've learnt to date (I ended up going with MBE as the place building it preferred this route!).

- throttle body injection system (Jenvey's DTH of course).

- head work. The usual porting work plus I'm sure you can get bigger/better valves into even the 1400 head.

- lightened flywheel.

 

I've heard rumours that up to 175bhp is possible out of the 1400 which would seem feasible...certainly 150-160 should be doable (the Supersport is meant to give 130 but I've also heard that this is optimistic and it's more likely to be 120-125).

 

To be honest though, I think I'd be inclined to go the higher capacity route as it's more of a known quantity. I also had some headaches upgrading my 1400SS to 'big k' spec, but as this route gets more common, it'll get easier for everyone else (as there are more people to give advice!). If you start with a "new" engine you can also take your time a bit more, safe in the knowledge you can still use the car even if you have delays.

 

Tomorrow I should have some details of my upgrade together...if you need more info then feel free to drop me a mail.

 

 

[Mick Day]

Hi Tony

I'd agree with Andy's posting on this. Prior to doing my epic re-build I considered this route. One thing to bear in mind is Dave Andrew's advice on valve sizes: the 1.4 bore is 75mm which will limit the size you can go to on valve diameters. Certainly turbo/supercharging is an option. Consider though what you will spend: it may be better to bite the bullet.

Mick

[CHRIS CLARK]

Hi Tony,

 

I'm going through the motions at present of working out an 1800 upgrade. You're right in saying that us original Caterham 1400 supplied engine owners have the old (for that read cheaper)wet linered 'K's. These can't be upgraded to the 1600, but a damp linered one can. These are the types fitted to the later metros etc. The cylinder heads are basically the same whether 1400/ 1600/ 1800 (discounting the VVC).I have a 1400 damp linered eng in bits on the bench at present for analysis/playing! The exhaust valves are small and seem to suffer. The VVC head has bigger valves and can therefore breath better but needs work to fit two cams instead of the original 4 cam set up.

 

Yours is an ex-race engine so I would assume it will already have shimmed cam followers instead of the std. hydraulic ones.

 

Turbo? See pages 95 & 96 of Chris Rees' book. No thanks, ta!

 

Would suggest a visit to Mr Dave Andrews great site only I can't remember the correct address! I'll sort it out!

"There ain't no substitute for cubes". English translation; The bigger the capacity, the better!!!

Good Luckthumbsup.gif

 

Edited by - chris clark on 7 Jan 2001 00:15:01

[Allen Payne]

Is there an easy way to tell, apart from dismanting, if a 1400 engine has 'wet' or 'damp' liners?

 

Thanks

Allen

 

Edited by - Allen Payne on 7 Jan 2001 10:42:17

[tony isherwood]

Many thanks for the replies.

 

I understand that if the 1400 block has dimonds or X's cast on the side of it, it is one of the blocks were liners cannot be changed for 1600 liners.

 

I tend to forget that the car is Ex' Doug Newman / Paul Harvey' It could have anything in it ;0). ( Probably an over honed 1400 >> 1500 ;o)).

 

I have had the gearbox re-ratioed after the sync rings went. Probably due to the previous owner was saving the clutch ;0).

 

I have not yet explored its inner workings on the engine. When I first had it, I managed to run dry and blow the head gasket ( or other way round) and Paul sorted the problem for me. When I fel brave I will lift the cam cover and see whats under it.

 

 

[Allen Payne]

Tony,

 

Are the new gearbox ratios a worthwhile improvement over the orginal?

 

If so what did you change them to?

 

Sorry to hi-jack this topic

Thanks

Allen

 

[CHRIS CLARK]

Tony,

Well worth a look! Remember that the head bolts are VERY long and you must not turn the crank with the head off 'cos those bolts hold everything together!!!!!!

 

What ratios did you use on the 'box?

 

Cheers, Chris

[Peter Carmichael]

The 1.4 liners are bombproof for any revs. With the 75mm bore they have 2.5mm extra wall thickness over the 1.6, 1.8 liners. Even with the 75mm bore, there is more potential in the head and a clever bit of modification should free up some more breathing. Remember that *big valves* don't, of themselves, make big power. Big valves are big bits of metal getting in the way of airflow. Big valves are only any good if they are covering big holes.

 

The modification of a k-head for a 1.4 would involve working with the valve throats to provide a better short turn into the cylinder and thinning out the valve seat inserts and reducing the seat width so that the same size of valve is covering a bigger and more useful hole. Some shaping (squaring) of the ports and work on the bifurcation will also be needed. All of this could be matched up with a throttle body conversion to give a useful power increae. Driveability throughout the range seems OK with throttle body fuel injection. There is probably no point in going beyond a 270 degree cam with this sort of head spec. The thermal loads on the pistons are the usual cause of piston break up above the 180bhp mark. You will probably be down at around the 160bhp level with a really good conversion so the pistons can stay as they are. The revs will be pushing 8000rpm which is about as far as is advisable with the standard rods. For use up to 8500rpm, budget another £1500 for rods, pistons and fitting to place you well into the arena of diminishing returns. Having written the above, it looks like 270 degree cams may be too much. Perhaps best to keep the power peak within an attainable range using less cam and limiting your ambitions to ~150bhp. (107bhp/litre).

 

The crankcase of the wet linered version is reinforced with diagonally crossing webs (XXXX). The damp linered (capacity changing a possibility) have a bulging shape in this area without crisscrossing webs.