Would you buy this engine?

[Miker7]

So this engine isn't too far from me & I want a VVC engine. However i can see some black 'stuff' from the cylinder head joint which makes me think the head is fubar and someone has tried liquid gasket to bodge it.

Do you think my suspicion is correct?

Am I mad for considering it?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/176429768695?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=yx3k3DHbSQe&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=xcyhac67Qzy&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[Mick Day]

It's been in an MGF. Owner hasn't heard it running. Assume the worst.

If you're prepared to get your hands dirty then it could be a cheapish way to build yourself a nice engine.

Really depends on how good the head is once dismantled etc.

Could end up as a garage ornament.

[Ainsley]

Well, its £200, so that and a day of taking it apart and measuring it will be all you risk.

Then, assuming its not beyond repair, whatever it costs to replace anything worn.  I suppose if the crank, bores and valves are OK and the head isn't warped, its just an engine rebuild.  But that will still cost money and time.

Worth a punt if you are prepared to then rebuild it with new bits.  Its the time and money to do that, that make the difference, not the initial £200.

Didn't these have a well earned reputation for head warping ?

[Miker7]

The alternative is to buy this - however I can't smuggle that into the garage without my wife knowing and I've still not got round to selling any xflow parts or the random Zetec engine i acquired 15 years ago.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/375494590421?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=KxEWH7BKREW&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

[Ainsley]

Bribery is your solution.

[Brownmonster]

37 minutes ago, Ainsley said:

Bribery is your solution.

It's a "safety upgrade" usually sorts that. 

[oilyhands]

9 hours ago, Miker7 said:

The alternative is to buy this - however I can't smuggle that into the garage without my wife knowing and I've still not got round to selling any xflow parts or the random Zetec engine i acquired 15 years ago.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/375494590421?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=KxEWH7BKREW&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

That’s a pre 1999 143 VVC, so the likliehood that the mileage is as stated is very low and it has the weaker stock K series pistons.

Oily

[Miker7]

Thank you all. I'll go back to saving the pennies for the lowered floor instead.

[revilla]

Good decision! Pretty sure I know what the gunge running down from the head joint is, seen it before. Stag Wellseal, it's a non-hardening bonding sealing compound used to bond steel saver shims used when the heads have gone soft. Basically tree resin in solvent. Horrible stuff and has a tendency to blow out down the sides like that. But the main thing about it is that it's only really used when the engine has issues.

[DirtBuddha]

13 hours ago, oilyhands said:

That’s a pre 1999 143 VVC, so the likliehood that the mileage is as stated is very low and it has the weaker stock K series pistons.

Oily

 

How can you identify a 160bhp vs 143bhp engine Oily?  Is it from the serial number, or are there any external identifiers?

Asking as a mate has a spare 1.8 VVC from a low mileage MGF which suffered front end damage, and I'd like to identify which version it is.

[oilyhands]

22 minutes ago, DirtBuddha said:

 

How can you identify a 160bhp vs 143bhp engine Oily?  Is it from the serial number, or are there any external identifiers?

Asking as a mate has a spare 1.8 VVC from a low mileage MGF which suffered front end damage, and I'd like to identify which version it is.

There are three easy indicators, the most obvious is the black top to the inlet plenum, 160 engines are raw aluminium and do not have the VVC logo on the top, another is the fact it is an EU2 and has the long HT leads coming up from the side of the block where the coil is mounted, 160 engines have plug top coils a and are EU3, the final easy spot is the plastic throttle body, 160 engines have an ally 52mm throttle body. Be aware however that there are a fair number of EU3 VVC engines which *do not have* 160 pistons, these appear to have been farmed out to the likes of Lotus and Caterham.

Oily

[oilyhands]

8 hours ago, revilla said:

Good decision! Pretty sure I know what the gunge running down from the head joint is, seen it before. Stag Wellseal, it's a non-hardening bonding sealing compound used to bond steel saver shims used when the heads have gone soft. Basically tree resin in solvent. Horrible stuff and has a tendency to blow out down the sides like that. But the main thing about it is that it's only really used when the engine has issues.

Spot on Andrew..

[DirtBuddha]

2 hours ago, oilyhands said:

There are three easy indicators, the most obvious is the black top to the inlet plenum, 160 engines are raw aluminium and do not have the VVC logo on the top, another is the fact it is an EU2 and has the long HT leads coming up from the side of the block where the coil is mounted, 160 engines have plug top coils a and are EU3, the final easy spot is the plastic throttle body, 160 engines have an ally 52mm throttle body. Be aware however that there are a fair number of EU3 VVC engines which *do not have* 160 pistons, these appear to have been farmed out to the likes of Lotus and Caterham.

Oily

 

Many thanks Oily...  I'll check my mate's engine and see if I can identify which version it is. 

 

 

[DirtBuddha]

On 03/07/2024 at 09:36, oilyhands said:

There are three easy indicators, the most obvious is the black top to the inlet plenum, 160 engines are raw aluminium and do not have the VVC logo on the top, another is the fact it is an EU2 and has the long HT leads coming up from the side of the block where the coil is mounted, 160 engines have plug top coils a and are EU3, the final easy spot is the plastic throttle body, 160 engines have an ally 52mm throttle body. Be aware however that there are a fair number of EU3 VVC engines which *do not have* 160 pistons, these appear to have been farmed out to the likes of Lotus and Caterham.

Oily

 
I’ve taken pics of the engine in question… see below. The engine code confirms 1.8 K series VVC, but I can’t find any information on the 3rd prefix code ‘M18’… 

 

Is there any definitive way to tell whether this is a Trophy 160 engine, or a 143bhp version? 
 

 

[oilyhands]

It’s not a 160, all *EU2* VVC engines are 143 and they have the weaker pistons. As I explained in my previous post.. it fails on the definitive tests, it’s EU2, it has the black topped plenum and a block mounted coilpack. All 160 engines are EU3 with plug top coils and natural aluminium plenums, if you have been told that it is 160, they lied.

Oily

[DirtBuddha]

1 hour ago, oilyhands said:

It’s not a 160, all *EU2* VVC engines are 143 and they have the weaker pistons. As I explained in my previous post.. it fails on the definitive tests, it’s EU2, it has the black topped plenum and a block mounted coilpack. All 160 engines are EU3 with plug top coils and natural aluminium plenums, if you have been told that it is 160, they lied.

Oily

Many thanks Oily. I didn’t say it was a 160, I just asked how to identify whether it was a 143 or 160. 
 

Thanks for the advice - I’ll let him know.