Leadership Team Shortshift Posted August 2, 2020 Leadership Team Share Posted August 2, 2020 Whatever the technical rights and wrongs of this, I am really enjoying the high quality graphics! James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 Thanks Mark, got a better understanding now.@James... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titanium7 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 As mine is still under warranty Oakmere has got agreement from Caterham to look at the overcooling so it's in there this morning. Here is the typical indicated temperature when running at 3000 revs with the ambient temperature around 15C. When you stop at traffic lights it shoots up to 90C when the fan kicks in and then drops again to 50C when you start motoring again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 It will be interesting to see how you get on. As you know mine is under warranty too but Oakmere wasn't prepared to do anything other than fit the preloaded one-off thermostat which CC recommended, a stat CC admit hasn't gone through testing etc. Your temp behaviour is the same as mine, although over the mountain I can get mine into the blue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 My carbuilder parts have arrived today, amazingly quick service! I'll put some photos up for completeness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 I've upload some pics of the parts to my instagram. https://www.instagram.com/caterham7diaries/The Gates flexible hoses are really nice, nice and thick, yet flexible, the internals are still smooth too. The thermostat housing is OK, its Gates too, but it's surprisingly heavy. I guess its due to the thick metal construction. RimmerBros shipped the 82c stat today too, so I'll have a choice. I've also bought some Red Viper Performance Superflex 32m and 19mm hoses, along with T clamp hose clamps. I've got plenty of parts to build with this weekend.If I can find the motivation this evening, I'm going to have a run up The Mountain with the GoPro and Easimap, (assuming the battery on the old laptap survives) to get a baseline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garybee Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 I've never been a fan of the Gates flexible hoses having used the Vulcoflex type in the past (maybe new version is different?). They tend to take a fair bit of force to form a curve. Good for mocking up a system though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 Thanks, I've got the Viperperformance hoses coming too, so I'll be able pick the better hose from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 Mine does none of this now, stays nice and warm. Let us see what does it say to the race track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 Unfortunately the GoPro went flat, I thought charging it off the PC all day would work, guess there wasn't sufficient current from the USB when the PC was in standby. Also didn't get an amazing run, however there's certainly enough data from the Easimap capture.If anyone wants to take a look, here's the capture in csv and native easimap.https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1K2JAa8DAJGlli3iE_PpQulZ5DcFm6tlF?usp=sharing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 Probably doesn't need any explanationLink to the jpghttps://drive.google.com/file/d/1W527DL6nsCDLzwGpG8VicEDfEsYFttXD/view?usp=sharing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share Posted August 3, 2020 Having studied my chart now, knowing where I was and the speed etc. I would suggest this has more to do with the force on the thermostat rather than volume of air passing through the radiator. The initial drop off in my graph was caused by strong use of RPM, but not high speed. Higher speed sections over the mountain were actually lower RPM and didn't result in as much cooling, although I appreciate the temps were much lower by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nutty7 Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 I would suggest this has more to do with the force on the thermostat rather than volume of air passing through the radiator.Could this not be proved, disapproved by just revving the engine when parked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark w Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 "Force on the thermostat " ? Maybe flow through the uncontrolled cut out around the thermostat ........,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark w Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 Markive sent you a mail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 4, 2020 Author Share Posted August 4, 2020 Replied. -- Easimap logging setup.Btw, the work we did last year on the ECU should provide the option to permanently log the car from the OBDII without the need for a laptop and then export in a similar fashion. We should be able to to get the hardware to around the size of a credit card, costing about 60GBP. Sadly it's just time and motivation to finish the project. Hopefully, we can get there, and share the solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shropshire AR Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 Well my 620 has been in Oakmere for a couple of days trying to address the overcooling issue.It appears they have changed the thermostat for what I can only assume is the preloaded one that CC have suggested. The result is the running temperature at 3K revs has now moved up from 50C to 60C. The biggest change is that the speed of change of the temperature is much slower. So it takes longer to warm up (not an issue for me). Overall on a 40 mile return journey back of country A roads with periods of high revs and mixed speeds Some stops at lights the temperature stayed between 65C and 80C. So, this does not negate the badly designed system and it’s inherent fault of not holding a steady temperature but it will do me for now until the warranty runs out or one of the team come up with a cost effective remedy.At the moment I would lean towards a PRRT system having good success with them in the past but may be persuaded otherwise when the current tests by others have been completed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 Hi Martyn, what exactly is preloaded thermostat? Stiffer spring?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titanium7 Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 Yes I suspect that's all it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark w Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 I don't see how a stiffer spring would cause it to take longer to warm up . If the stiffer spring slows the thermostat opening you would think the reverse is true . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrp Posted August 4, 2020 Share Posted August 4, 2020 I'm not sure this post is helpful, but it is really interesting to follow as an engineer. I was lucky enough to have the choice between a 420R and a 620R both of which were available within my budget when I decided to upgrade and trade in my 140 Supersport. Also having met IOM Mark at last years Chippy run.As far as usability as I don't do track stuff I'm now pleased I choose 420R also following this thread.For those of you that know me and what happened just after I took delivery, should be happy to know that RBTB are being added during the repair I hope.Mrp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonT Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 Would drilling the thermostat have the effect described? You'd always get some flow through the rad, so it would take longer to warm up, but you'd also then need /much/ more flow to push it open under flow rather than temperature alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shropshire AR Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 No need to drill the thermostat as there's a milled cut out in the housing already allowing flow through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elie boone Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 I have to admit i am not familiar with the 620 primary cooling set up but what if the primary circuit would only heat up the oil cooler ? so to connect the metal tube behind the thermostat to the oil cooler and going from there to the cylinder head outlet that way you would have a cooling flow in the engine and a more steady rise and fall in cooling temp when the main circuit opens but then one can't use the ali. thermostat housing with the big hole in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CtrMint Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share Posted August 5, 2020 Having spent a fortune on hoses and connectors, I might be stuck before getting going. I kinda worked from memory regarding the space available, a bit of an amateur mistake I know. Having been into the garage this evening and offered up the PRT housing I have to say, there is surprisingly little room for the additional hoses and PRT stat. I've spent a small fortune on hoses to give me the greatest potential for success, even so, I think I'm being overly optimistic about getting stuff routed without risk of contact to the intercooler or belts.The solution Mark W is working on in the other thread is probably the better strategy at this time... I was so confident about this weekend too. Kinda gutted my skills are letting me down here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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