Widetrack suspension fitting and riv nuts UPDATE

[wild bill]

Having stuck my seven in to a lamp post due to inattention im now rebuilding. I've done the suspension before but cannot remember it being such an arseache.

Lower wish bone widetrack the manual says no washer between front wishone and chassis (OK but seems weird) rear mount 4 washers between chassis leg and wishone and no mention of a washer between rear mount and bracket.

Well i cannot get 4 washers in there for love or money. I understand the decision was taken to move the widetrach rearwards in order to lighten the steering which became heavy using the standard washer set up.

As it currently sits it looks like the bracket will bend if the bolts are all tightened up but as i can't get the washers in it's currently academic. 

The car came back with no riv nuts fitted to secure the rear wings and the holes are too big for M5's so im going M6 through necessity. Is there a knack to riv nut fitting?i've got the tool but my 3 tests have been disastrous. Today i have achieved absolutely FA

Puts on Penelope Pitstop voice "Haylp Haylp"

Caterham manual is so lame too with a poor lack of explanation IMHO

 

OK Update. 

I fitted the 4 washers first with the rear bolt then fitted the front bolt. It doesn't look right to me with no washers between wishbone and front chassis member or wishbone and rear bracket but that's what the manual says and nothing's torqued up yet.

As for rivnuts, i kinda knew i needed to keep experimenting on some scrap metal and scrap washers and finally i got the tool tensioned and set correctly and the first rivnut is now in and works as it should. Tomorrow ill slowly tackle the rest and fit the rear wings. Then i'll move on to the remainder of the front suspension.

[nickh7]

I’ll take a look tomorrow on my WT 

[Jonathan Kay]

Sorry to hear about the lamp post encounter.

Glad to hear that the RIVNUTs® are now biting: which material and which tool?

Are you intending to use nylon bolts for the wings?

Jonathan

[wild bill]

 There were 4 other accidents at the same spot in 10 days so maybe there was diesel or gravel on the road but i should have been more awake but my concentration was not great at that time for different reasons. Still it was at about 20mph luckily and bang head on so i got away very lightly. Only accident in 65000 miles of sevening. 

The rivnuts are ally and ive used stainless steel temporarily but intend to go nylon, although they,ve always been steel since i bought the car in 2004.

Tool is a sealey professional borrowed from Beckington Motors who i live next door to. They'll put the engine and gearbox back in. Need to book my gearbox in to Phil at Road and Race unless anyone knows someone nearer to Bath.

What i can't find anywhere is a proper diagram and explanation of the front widetrack assembly. I know how it goes together but it's the details like which washers where. I took photos on dis assembly but not detailed enough to see the washer positions. How difficult would it be for Caterham to put a diagram and explanation into the bag with the wishbone along with the relevant bolts and washers?

 

[Tazio]

Bill,

I am just rebuilding mine like you, on the lower wishbone, the photos I took show 2 washers either side of the lower wishbone at the rear fixing, so 4 washers do go in, and at the front the pic shows a large washer and spring washer on the front under the bolt head at the front of the chassis.

Can send pics if you want.

Alan

[wild bill]

Hi Tazio

That is the standard arrangement of washers however Caterham's manual puts all 4 washers between the rear mount and the chassis leg and removes all other washers on widetrack suspension. This was to move the wishbone further back on the widetrack suspension in order to alleviate the heaviness of the steering caused by widening the track. It just seems odd to me but it's what Caterham state.

The question that then arises is in the top wishbone what is the correct washer placement as this isn't mentioned as far as i can read unless i'm missing something.

[Tazio]

Bill,

i beg to differ, I have the installation instructions from section 6 of the front suspension, widetrack installation which states that on fitting the rear leg of the wishbone, two 3mm thick washers are to be installed either side of the wishbone. 

The front leg attaches with the washer and lock washer at the front of the leg with two 1 1/8" washers between the wishbone and the the chassis.

There is a note which states ' that the distribution of these washers may need to be altered to allow any tolerances in the wishbones. Redistribution will also enable subsequent adjustment of castor angles.

hope this helps.

[Jonathan Kay]

The rivnuts are ally and ive used stainless steel temporarily but intend to go nylon, although they,ve always been steel since i bought the car in 2004.

Tool is a sealey professional...

Thanks

Jonathan

[wild bill]

Hi Jonathan i checked, it's not a sealey it's a 'Blue Point' which is a snap on brand i think.

Hi Tazio, Caterham really like to cause confusion but the note about distribution varying would seem to make sense.

[Jonathan Kay]

:-)

Jonathan

[wild bill]

It seems there is no hard and fast. So apparently Caterham have recently started to use the 2 2 2 arrangement having previously recommeded widetrack as 0 4 0 possibly the change was to make factory builds simpler. There's loads in the archives on here too but it seems to be a suck it and see as washer movement changes steering feel and castor.