Show plates illegal for road use

[DRH]

Hi Chaps

I believe show plate size number plates are illegal for road use, what are the consequences or does it go unnoticed.

The normal size plates look so silly on the front.

[Keith_T]

IIRC in old days on blatchat there was extensive discussion on front numberplate size.  I believe it was thought a correctly sized plate - particularly with a gurney "flap" underneath - could provide a bit of downforce to reduce understeer.

[Jonathan Kay]

Thee's some discussion in the archives: you can cut down the total size of the plate while keeping the symbols within regulations. And enforcement doesn't seem to be common.

You'll also find assertions that:

1. No-one cares if you stick an adhesive version on the bonnet.
2. The penalty is lower for removing the front one, keeping it in the car and saying that it has just fallen off. I wouldn't bet that way.

Jonathan

[Wrightpayne]

I used to have small front plates (45mm high characters) but went back to a full sized car front plate a few years ago, as couldnt be bothered swapping for the MOT.

I have a 5 digit registration which could easily be trimmed width wise whilst still retaining the normal car sized characters, which would probably be OK.

As Keith mentions there are aero benefits to a full size plate.

Ian

[DRH]

The down force idea is interesting, what's a gurney flap Keith?

I met a guy last week with a Dax Rush with a V8 engine and he said at 140 mph the car was starting to lift of the ground and was considered some type of fins to create some down force.

[DRH]

Do you have to put Caterham in small letters at the bottom of the plate

[Jonathan Kay]

"INF104: vehicle registration numbers and number plates"

Jonathan

[Jonathan Kay]

I'm going to take a lot of convincing about downforce. But there is an existing CFD model...

Jonathan

PS:

... some type of fins to create some down force.

I read that as "fans". :-)

[JNC]

I was told the other day what I thought was a good Idea ! Instead of sticking it to the nose cone make some brackets to hold the number plate tipped back at the top to aid air flow to the grill and radiator like a scoop .

forgot to say I use smaller plates front and back not been stopped or any problem with MOT 

[Tony Whitley]

Except the regs say the plate must be vertical:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/pdfs/uksi_20010561_en.pdf 6.3
 

Fixing of front registration plates

This paragraph requires the plate to be fixed— (a) vertically or, where that is not reasonably practicable, in a position as close to the vertical as is reasonably practicable,

[rj]

But officer... A vertical numberplate causes a lot of drag. That's not "as is reasonably practicable" as this would require change of engine to obtain the same level of performance...

[JNC]

Tony . How do people get on when the front plate is stuck on the top of the nose cone ? The old way .

[Jonathan Kay]

The anecdotal experience is that no-one cares.

Jonathan

[john milner]

I don't think that legal stick on plates are manufactured.

I read somewhere that the penalty for illegal plates are points plus fine but no plate is just the fine. That means illegal plates are less likely to result in being caught but you have no excuse so if caught you will be nicked and no plates have the excuse "very sorry it must have just fell off" which might work and possibly has the lower penalty if if doesn't. For the risk of being nicked for something I can't even see when driving I would keep it legal.

[pikeyboy]

I've had no front plate on mine for years now.

[Jonathan Kay]

Edited: Crossed with pikeyboy's.

I read somewhere that the penalty for illegal plates are points plus fine but no plate is just the fine.

Yes, that's the assertion I referred to in post #3. But a cursory look* didn't reveal support either in the regulations or in actual penalties imposed.

(If I were adjudicating I wouldn't be too impressed by a defendant who I thought was deliberately breaking the rules compared with one who made a mistake out of ignorance. As the legal aphorism doesn't say: Nemo asinum callidum amat).

Jonathan

* Only a cursory look because I agree with your last sentence. 

[DRH]

A few people commented one had a £1000 fine and another motor bike rider £2,600 fine for incorrect number plates.

Went and bought normal size front plate today, put it on the car and I hate it, I will just have to look away.

[Jonathan Kay]

£2,600 seems enormous. Any more information... multiple offences, aggravating circumstances?

Jonathan

[Stridey]

Judging by the number of naked front plated cars (Ferraris, Lambos and souped up Audis and BMWs mostly) around here I'd be amazed if a 7 was done for it. But that's round here, other areas may vary. I wouldn't be comfortable driving with no plate on the front, but would consider a stick on one.

I too feel a full sized pate looks big on a 7. I found a 5 digit plate and got them made up full size, but for 5 digit size, so not as long. These are legal* . You can even justify the expense with man maths as they save weight and possibly more aero...(!). DVLA direct is a good place to seek out   C7 xxx plate or similar at a good price.

*technically my plates aren't legal as they don't have the post code of the manufacturer on them, but they are raised letter style not flat perspex and are the legal style of what was available at the time the car was made.  I do know hey are recognised by cameras as I've be charged by Dartford Crosding. m'lud.

[mossy7]

The actual offence wording is  " Fails to conform to regulations" , which also includes having no plate fitted, ( see link from Jonathan) but is also is referred as "Miss representation" particularly when font, size and spacing is altered and fails to conform. The real world test is whether the plate can be easily read by eye or an ANPR camera and prosecution in such cases is often a matter of the discretion of the Police Officer who stops you. Of note, you only llikely to be stopped for this offence by a Traffic cop as local guys and girls are either too busy or not familiar with the regulations.

The offence is dealt with by way of a non endorsabe ( ie no points) fine of £100 if dealt with at the roadside; you would receive paperwork and later a conditional fine of £100 in the post.( conditional in that you must admit the offence and pay, if not you get a court date)  A referral is sent to DVLA and if the same driver continues to drive with an illegal number plate, ie is caught twice or more and DVLA receive multiple notifications, DVLA can rescind the number plate and Re issue an age related plate to the car. This is a particular ouch for someone who has spent thousands on a private plate and has altered it by font or spacing for example especially as DVLA can sell the plate again to a new owner and are under no obligation to give a refund to the original owner. Lesson being, don't take the whatsit. 

If there are aggravating circumstances, for example multiple offences or the plate has been altered by say black tape for the purposes,of avoiding detection by speed cameras or ANPR, then the matter can go to court and the maximum fine increases to £1000 for the plate offence, whilst other offences such as Obstruct Police or Pervert the Course of justice could be considered.

[thompster]

Despite what the rules say there are some absolute shockers on the road and people seem to get away with it.  There's a long running pistonheads thread full of photos of essentially fraudulent plates on cars - you have to see some it to believe it.  The qashqai on the link below give an idea how much the old bill care..

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1534373&i=4320

[Tony Whitley]

At Stoneleigh Kit Car Show in 2013.

[nickh7]

I d say you are not going to get stopped for a number plate infringement but if you've been caught driving like a naughty person it may get added to the other misdemeanours. 

For the record I am sure my number plate is the right size. 

[Toby S]

I have run with a front plate stuck to the nose cone for about a year and so far haven't had a problem with Mr Plod - I think generally they leave us alone unless you're doing something extremely naughty or if they are a petrol head and are interested in knowing more about the car.

Other comments are quite correct - it is technically illegal, but you throw the dice and takes your chance

[BigCol]

I too have a stick-on plate on my nose cone.

The car passed its MoT and at the EuroTunnel terminal was successfully read by their ANPR thingy (unlike other sevens with "proper" number plates), so I hope/assume it's OK...