horn works only when steering wheel is slightly to the right

[Hanns Per]

cant find whats going on, the horn only goes when I turn the steering whee to the right, there is a position when it starts. When I go back to straight it stops again. I does not work when I shortcut the contact pin to the steering wheel. Its not the cable from the pin to the block, crazy?

thks hanns per

[SM25T]

To help others help you ..... it is a CSR .... does it have a centre horn push, or is it on a column stalk ?

[Hanns Per]

Oh yes its a center push horn and a fixed steering wheel, there are levers for the signals beam and wiper, does it help?

[SM25T]

It must be something silly with the cable moving as the wheel is turned, or the spring contacts that take the voltage from the moving part to the fixed part. Perhaps it is broken inside the insulation ?

[Jonathan Kay]

I'd check first that it always works when you short that wire to a good earth somewhere else. That will make sure that we're looking at the right bit. 

Is there a specific earth wire from the column? If so clean and reconnect. 

Can you take a photo of the contacts on the wheel?

Jonathan

[Hanns Per]

so checked on and found that the steering column started to earth only on at the certain position. Was not the cas until recently.

Connected a cable to the steering column from the body and now it works again

thks

HP

[SM25T]

Maybe light corrosion on the contact surface ?

[David aka Blue7]

Hans

You will probably find that the "rotary horn slip ring" is the problem, the brass slip ring is just glued to the plastic boss and eventually breaks free causing shorting problems.  The component is here:

http://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product.php?id_product=1298

I had to replace two.  You must have an older CSR because CC have not fitted a central horn push button since at least 2012 and possibly earliier and they reverted to the dash mounted button ... probably because of problems with that component but they won't admit it.

 

[2004Academy80]

Resurrecting an old thread as it's pretty applicable.

Yesterday I turned a right corner and my horn came on and stayed on, quite embarrassing as cars thought I was aiming it at them until I was able to pull over, it only stopped when I pulled the fuse, pressing the horn button (in steering wheel), moving the steering wheel made no difference.  

Even after the fuse was pulled I could hear clicking (Is this normal relay behaviour or could this be the cause)?

Thanks

Alex

[Jonathan Kay]

Even after the fuse was pulled I could hear clicking (Is this normal relay behaviour or could this be the cause)?

All the time, or only when you pressed the horn button?

Do you have a multimeter?

Jonathan

[David aka Blue7]

This "sounds" (excuse pun) like an old CSR problem but you don't say what your car is? 

You will probably find that the "rotary horn slip ring" is the problem, the brass slip ring is just glued to the plastic boss and eventually breaks free causing shorting problems.  The component is here:

http://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product.php?id_product=1298

[MADMALC]

Hi Blue, does this ring take the live feed to the horn? If so where is the earth return feed? Had a 'no horn' issue on a csr his weekend and the only 'cure' was to earth the steering column with a new separate wire.

All additional knowledge would be happily received.

[Jonathan Kay]

IIRC on most 7s the horn button connects a relay terminal to earth via the steering column.

Jonathan

[2004Academy80]

It was happening "clicking" intermittently, not when pressing the horn.

I do have a multimeter but I'm a novice when it comes to electrical issues.  If I can see it I can fix it but wires are another level.

I was wondering if it was a simple relay issue prior to stripping the steering wheel down. 

Blue - car is a 2004 academy.   

Thanks guys - helpful as ever.

[Jonathan Kay]

What model and dash?

You can probably test the relay of interest by swapping it with a neighbour.

Which fuse did you pull, are you sure it's the right one, and was it blown?

Jonathan

[Jonathan Kay]

I do have a multimeter but I'm a novice when it comes to electrical issues.  If I can see it I can fix it but wires are another level.

Have you got a wiring diagram for your car? Let me know if you'd like one. 

Jonathan

[2004Academy80]

1.6 K-series here's a pic from when I bought it.

All fuses are labeled.

As soon as I pulled the fuse the horn stopped sounding, 

Didn't look blown, relay was still clicking.

I don't have a wiring diagram, thanks for the offer.

[Jonathan Kay]

Private Mail sent

Jonathan

[2004Academy80]

Correct me if I am wrong but if the relay is clicking it sounds like Blue7's analysis would be correct, copper disc shorting.

I'll strip it down and investigate.

Thanks guys.

Alex

[David aka Blue7]

Well I have not seen a K series with a horn button in the centre before, they were usually removable Momos.  Your issue could be different to the one on my CSR.  As Jonathan suggested you could try a new relay before dismantling the steering wheel boss.

When my problem occurred I could hear a scraping noise as I turned the steering wheel, which was the copper ring scraping against the boss after detaching from the assembly.

Madmalc ... it is such a long time ago now I just don't recall the set up for certain but I have a vague idea that pressing the horn button completed the circuit to activate the horn relay. 

On my last two CSR's the horn button is still in the centre of the steering wheel but is not connected up, instead there is the button on the dashboard.  CC said that they had so many problems with copper ring detaching from assy. that they resorted to the standard dash button.

[2004Academy80]

I'll try the relay as it's the quickest but I do think it's definitely connected to movement of the steering wheel.  It did it very briefly a couple of months ago when I pushed on the steering wheel, it then stopped and wouldn't do it again, so didn't think too much of it.

Do I need to unscrew the steering wheel or does the horn button come out if prized with plastic levers from the front?

Motolita from original build sheet ;-)  

 

 

[Jonathan Kay]

I have not seen a K series with a horn button in the centre before, they were usually removable Momos. 

it is such a long time ago now I just don't recall the set up for certain but I have a vague idea that pressing the horn button completed the circuit to activate the horn relay. 

My 1998 1800 K looked just like that picture...until I changed it to a removable Momo with a button on the dash. :-)

And it is the type that takes a relay terminal to earth through the steering column.

Do I need to unscrew the steering wheel or does the horn button come out if prized with plastic levers from the front?

Amended: See #23 and #25.

Jonathan

[David aka Blue7]

Do I need to unscrew the steering wheel or does the horn button come out if prized with plastic levers from the front?

 My horn button just prizes out but to remove the boss I required a steering wheel boss extractor tool with my present car.  With previous cars I was able to just remove the central securing nut and east the boss and wheel off the splines.  Make a note / mark the original position of the boss so that it is replaced straight.

[2004Academy80]

Good tip, thanks.

[Jonathan Kay]

Do I need to unscrew the steering wheel or does the horn button come out if prized with plastic levers from the front?

Amended:

The horn button can be removed without anything else. But to get to the horn contact ring the wheel and boss must be removed, see #23 above. Usual facial precautions.

Jonathan