Mark Durrant Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 I am posting this on behalf of Paul who currently has minimal access to Blatchat. In addition to this post you will shortly receive an email from Chris B containing the same content. The club would appreciate if you could consider this request and support us in lodging an ojection with the MSA.Many thanksMarkL7C Competitor----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------All The MSA Speed Events Committee has proposed a change to prohibit the use of List 1b and 1c tyres in road-going classes from 1 January 2017. This will have a significant impact to our championship and the club believe it is not in the best interests of competitors not only from the Lotus 7 Club but in road-going classes in general. This was only recently drawn to our attention and the consultation period ends on 12 June so we need to act quickly. If you share our concerns please can you cut and paste the following text into an email and send to: SpeedConsultation@msauk.org I will be making representations on behalf of the club and if you know competitors who compete in road-going classes in other championships please bring this to their attention. Many thanks Regards Paul ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ To: SpeedConsultation@msauk.org Subject: Objection to proposed Regulation Change to Section S Wheels and TyresThis regulation change will affect all Roadgoing Series Production Cars and Roadgoing Specialist Production Cars. So every car currently competing in the roadgoing classes of Sprint & Hillclimb.The effect will be to ban all List 1B & 1C tyres, which will have a major impact on the sport as currently significant numbers of competitors use these tyres.The Lotus 7 Club classes 3 to 6 will either have to fit list 1a tyres or move to class 7. This will affect around 57% of competitors registered in our championship who will either have to try and cope with up to 310bhp on list 1 a tyres, very dangerous in my opinion or face the additional cost of buy a set of slicks and wets. The Lotus 7 Club changed the championship regulations to allow list 1b tyres for all cars in excess of 150bhp to improve safety of competitors. This rule change fails to recognise that Caterham supply new cars with List 1b tyres which were developed by Avon Tyres specifically for the demands placed on tyres by Caterham’s lightweight, powerful sportscars. Therefore the proposed change if approved will result in a new competitor having with the additional cost of tyres and/or wheels which will make competing even less attractive to the novice. This conflicts with the MSA’s campaign of Go Motorsport.Most high performance cars eg:- Porsche, Ferrari, Lotus etc together with performance saloons eg Audi RS, BMW M Series and Mercedes AMG all have these tyres fitted as standard by the manufacturer and it is believed that list 1A tyres are actually NOT available for some of these vehicles. Thus effectively banning the vehicle from competing.Almost all of the Roadgoing Specialist Production cars not only come with list 1B tyres from the manufacturers, but the vast majority of Championships specifically allow them.I therefore object to this change and request that it does not go ahead.[insert name][insert MSA Licence number] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Support Team Shaun_E Posted June 2, 2015 Support Team Share Posted June 2, 2015 Objection sent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punch Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 All ready sent different wording same sentiment/objectionsPhilip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookie Monster Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon.Rogers Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Posted on Facebook and West Wales Hillclimb Club and Brecon/Epynt. It will also go on Swansea MC site.Lynn - you are a member of BARC can you post on their forum?If you are a member of other clubs please share. My reply is goin gto be a little longer than the one above! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david nelson Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 I feel we have lack of information. Is it going to be the current list 1a or all E marked tyres? From our championship its class 5 and 6 that are the main issue. How does this fit with the rest of Europe? What classes are there in Fia classes and what tyres are allowed?i think it is wrong that the MSA have not been more open with this and had a proper consolation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted June 2, 2015 Author Share Posted June 2, 2015 DavidClick here to see what has been published about this by the MSA, considering the implications not very imformative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apjenkins Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leg Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Simon,It's already on BARC and HSA .Lynn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david nelson Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 MSA still fail to give any real information. We know that list 1b were then going to be list 1c but we how have no idea what list 1a will be as no definition or list given. The whole thing is been put together poorly with a lack of transparency. Without proper information there is no other option but to contact the MSA and question what they are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Willoughby Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Corker Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Comments sent, but will they be heeded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamV Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Like everyone else I think this is a very worrying proposal but I have some sympathy with the MSA: Cars in ‘Roadgoing’ classes by definition have to be road legal. So to be road legal the tyres will have to be E-Marked. Remember - many competitors drive their cars to events so this is really important for them; As we all know: due to changes in EU legislation the current List 1B may disappear altogether or perhaps reduced to a couple of harder compound tyres – like the new Toyo R888r (rolling resistance is now ‘F’ rated – which is the same as a List 1A Yokohama A539); My sympathy point: The MSA can only list tyres that the manufactures produce. If the manufacturers don’t actually make softer compound tyres that also satisfy EU regulations then there is not a lot the MSA can do about it. i.e. there is no point in having a List 1B with no tyres on the list; I think the key meeting is the ‘MSA Tyre Committee’ which is due to meet this autumn – that should bring some clarity as to what tyres are actually going to be available in 2016 and 2017; Once the MSA know a) what tyres are available, b) what tyres will be e-marked and c) what tyres will be marked as ‘Designed for Racing Purposes‘... then they can be appropriately listed. I would then hope that the MSA would publish the proposed lists as early as possible and consult its members; My bit of speculation: For 2016 – I would expect a transitional period where current List 1B tyres that are 'e-marked and road legal' can continue to be used for competition in the appropriate Roadgoing classes. For 2017 - I wouldn’t be surprised if we end up with just two simple lists instead of three – List 1) All ‘E-Marked’ tyres and List 2) All ‘Designed for Racing’ tyres.I have objected to the proposal but I think this is just one issue in a much bigger pile of poo.GrahamV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 GrahamThe MSA should not change the regulations just because a tyre manufacurer might stop making a list 1b tyre and I cannot forsee all the manufacturers wasting the money they have spent developing tyres. In my opinion this has been poorly handled by the MSA and the fact that it has not been widely publicised, lets face it an email to all the Comp Secs who have a Championship permit would not take much effort, has the hallmarks that some on the Speed and Hillclimb committee are not interested in the views of the clubs or competitors. At a time the MSA are promoting 'Go Motorsport' they are not considering the views of existing competitors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OliW Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I've already told the MSA where they can shove my licence renewal if they go through with this plan - nicely thouhg of course.:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drumster Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Sent.Mark,My understanding is that the manufactures are not stopping making the List 1b tyres but they have been legislated off the road by Brussels and all such tyres therefore will no longer be E marked and hence moved in to the new List 1c as race tyres.It's a PITA for sprinting and even more of a PITA for me as the favoured choice for road going tyres for the last 13 years have been Yoko 21s . I can still buy them just no longer E marked..... hence illegal fo rthe road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david nelson Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Graham i agree with you and we need to understand if it's going to be all E marked tyres. The lack of information was one of my many points I made to the MSA. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon.Rogers Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 and thats why they should not be consulting or proposing rule changes with out the facts or knowledge.or do they know more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gill E Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Email sent too.I agree that its all a bit of a mess but if people don't object, the mess will just get passed, rather than scrutinised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Bowler Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Polite email sent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Smith Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 Done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 Only a few days left to let the MSA know how you feel about the proposed changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikes Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Sent from me too. with a few additional bits.Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy couchman Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Unless I've misunderstood... the new rules will mean 'new' list 1B tyres will not be road legal. That means a roadgoing car may not be driven on them - you'd have to trailer the car or else change tyres when you get to an event. 'Old' list 1B tyres will presumably be OK until they have worn out?What about 1A tyres that have been treated to make them softer. Illegal for competition purposes?Does sound like a mess but can also sympathise with the MSA - it cannot condone illegality and shurely roadgoing cars should be road legal when they compete?Help!!Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now