andy couchman Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 James Whiting does some good stuff that cuts weight. His Alcon 4 pot calipers are light, beautifully made and use the standard discs (which can be cross-drilled to save a gram or three). JW also does some ace CNC machined front hubs that are pre-drilled for either Ford or Triumph (live axle) wheels. They look the dogs' in gold... Add Freestyle's new AVO shocks (30% lighter) put some helium in the tyres and it'll float... On which subject, my short cockpit chassis (pre honeycomb sides) had builders grade expanded polystyrene sheets fitted between the inner and oputer panels. Not as strong as honeycomb (which I have now replaced with) but better than an air gap and helps the car to float on water (not). At the Autosport show, Cambridge Motorsport said that they were planning to make some carbon fibre pushrods for the Crossflow engine (Arnie Webb eat yer heart out!). If they do, buy 9 so you can show your friends (or buy 1 to impress them and run standard pushrods). Ah, adding lightness... wasn't that one of Chapman's maxims? Incidentally, JW's disc brake conversion for the Ital axle also uses cross drilled sics and CNC hubs in gold. Andy Couchman Q831FDD crossflow engined live axle car currently being rebuilt with the above. Will report on how it went later this year if anyone's interested Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFA Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Whats a pushrod???? Arnie Webb The Fat Bloke back @ 512k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted January 19, 2003 Author Share Posted January 19, 2003 chelspeed (risk of spelling graeme/graham wrong here... ) - i've not had the front apart for a while so got very confused seeing steel and alloy hubs on the parts list. thats for the info. solid front disks means different calipers as the APs are sized for the vented disk and have no spacer i can remove - are the JW alcon's reckoned to be the best thing then 🤔 Would be nice to get them from Hi-spec as well to try and get a bit of money off for buying 4 in stead of 2 calipers.... wouldn't even a very chunky upright be lighter 🤔 or would the top joint be a problem as its thickness is important - any thicker and the wingstay wouldn't fit... Andy - Fluke do much lighter disks by skimming them heavily - they claim over 1kg per disk on a Westie. I may ring JW and get him to list what they can do. I'm still in the research phase at the moment. HOOPY 500 kg R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelspeed Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 I'm a Graham rather than a Graeme but answer to both... I had the normal AP race four pots fitted for a couple of years but went solid discs to save weight. BG Developments (AP agent in Bromsgrove) made some alloy bell solid discs for me and modded the AP calipers to suit, split them, milled a bit off and reassembled with a shorter link pipe. Personally I really like the look of the Alcons from James Whiting and would go that way myself if I was starting now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edmandsd Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 I tried carbon fibre pushrods in my crossflow 7 years ago..............unsuccessfully. The pushrods I would recommend are the tubular ones from Arias which are lighter but more importantly far more rigid than the standard ones when your using the high valve acceleration cams such as Kent's 264/272. Home of BDR700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted January 19, 2003 Author Share Posted January 19, 2003 cheers Graham Anybody want to give to my new charity "seven owners with upgraditis" we guarentee ALL money is spent on improving sevens.... HOOPY 500 kg R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe 90 Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 The standard upright weighs 2.35 kg (including stub axle and steering arm) and the iron front hub weighs 2.55 kg. Caterham don't offer an alloy front hub with Ital studs ☹️, so it will have to be JW. 99,000 miles so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Carbon pushrods? Probably not a good idea. The only ones that I've seen were ones that had failed. There used to be a company in Selhurst near Croydon making them. Don't know if they are still around. Chrome moly tubing is best. The Yanks have got pushrods down to a fine art. Didn't know Arias made any though. I've sold hundreds of US sourced CROMO pushrods for motorcycles fitted with high lift cams and high poundage springs (12.5 mm lift with 240 lbs over the nose). Haven't had a single one come back. I would listen to Edmandsd and fit CROMO ones. As for saving weight I tend to nibble away at things. Junked the dual horns for a small motorcylce one and saved 800 grms. Removed the tax disc holder and stuck the disc on the screen, 125 grms. Shorten all the bolts that stick out too far, 100 grms? I have purchased a reversing light and fog light that are smaller and saved 200 grms. I have some skimpy double ended coils that will save over a kilo on the stock Zetec one. Lighter front calipers (but unfortunately with larger diameter heavier discs) 2.5 kilos. Odyssey battery, 2.5 kilos. Titanium silencer 2.5 kilos. Titanium stone guards on rear arches (don't like carbon fibre, car is quaintly old fashioned looking)- 700 grms. Th original weigh a kilo! Rear light cluster supports. Bleedin' heavy. Luke Beaumont should be making some of these. Mark Hicks has started up a Seven tuning company near Long Stratton (Anglia Sevens 0781 4477964) . I've only met him a couple of times but he is a smart cookie with lots of experience. He's ordered some corner weight scales from the States. As soon as my car is up and running again I want to over to see him and find out what my car actually weighs and what the weight distribution is. Maybe we could organise a kind weighing session with him and do a bit of socialising as well? I have organised a couple of Dyno and Curry days that seemed to go down quite well (and raised a few quid for NTL). Any thoughts? AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miraz Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 For Sale - nice lightweight front calipers - picture here - will fit 14" wheel...err...make that a 14" disk. Oops - back to the drawing board. Miraz Edited by - Miraz on 19 Jan 2003 21:56:46 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Miraz I clicked the link and got a picture of a skateboard. Could you please check that you posted the correct picture? Thanks AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miraz Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 looks like the right picture - would a side-view help? here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Why did someone take the wheels off that skateboard? Bleedin' Nora that's one big caliper. What's it off? AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miraz Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 It's off the tintop - unfortunately one of the pistons has seized, so I'm trying to resurrect it. Also trying to persuade the warranty company to replace it with a nice new set of 365mm discs and AP 6 pot calipers 😬 Edited by - Miraz on 19 Jan 2003 22:57:56 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Is that one of those thingies the Aussies race at Bathurst? Looks very antipodean in a V8 sort of way. Brace yourself Sheila. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miraz Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Comes with the soundtrack and everything.... 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 19, 2003 Share Posted January 19, 2003 Gis a go mister. AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edmandsd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Funnily enough the carbon pushrods I used came from the firm in Croyden you're referring to Ammo. Home of BDR700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Ammo, Shorten all the bolts that stick out too far, 100 grms? Quite mad! Although I was thinking of changing some nuts&bolts to shortened nylon ones 😬 Greg, Q 86 NTM (Green 185BHP XF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edmandsd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Just out of interest.......the carbon fibre pushrods failed because they were too thick and just touched the head when in operation. The Arias ones will withstand up to 600 lb on the nose valve spring pressure but you will need to slightly machine the top cups where the rocker locates as they're too deep and chip away otherwise. With a steel 272 cam you could actually see the standard pushrods flexing, even when turning over the engine by hand on the bench, using the larger diameter Pinto valve springs ! As far as I can remember the price of these pushrods is £10 each...........but well worth it. Home of BDR700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonycaterham Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 I have a ford axle in my 7 which befgore I fitted I had brackets but on by Arch. This included the welding of a large brace onto the axle which must wiegh quite a bit and it seems to serve no purpose other than to carry the handbrake linkage. I used to rally in the 70's and we braced axles to stop then bending , but this is not applicabe to a seven. Surely my hopefully 200BHP engine is not going to twist the axle or is it? I was thinking of cutting some large holes in the plate to save some weight. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edmandsd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Tony - Be careful because the bracing is there to add strength/rigidity to the axle. I agree that the solid bar is heavy but I still had my english axle braced with box section steel behind the diff. If you don't do this one way or another your diff nose will leak continually - I've seen it for myself on an English axled Caterham with mildly tuned Lotus Twink which was only used on the road. Home of BDR700 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Greg Shortening bolts may be taking it a bit far. But as I want to keep my screen, heater and carpets I thought I'd nibble at everything else. I used to own a race bike that started life weighing 225 kilos. After five years of racing I managed to get it down to 169 kilos dry, to everybody's disbelief. The first couple of years was fairly easy. Then it became more difficult to find stuff to chop off. The real secret was, as Peter rightly points out, is chucking out stuff that doesn't do anything. I used to lay awake at night thinking what I could do. At one point we were shedding weight at the rate of 100 to 200 grms per day. We wasted the cylinder studs down to the root diameter of the threads, just leaving a register for the cylinder and heads. Looked at every single nut and bolt on the whole engine and chassis. We got around 15 kilos out of the engine and gearbox (we did change pistons, rods, crank, chopped down jackshafts etc.). Chucked out all the relays, fuses and 200 grms of loom. Smaller disc on the rear (Something I might do on my Caterham if the rear end is over braked). Etc. etc. etc. Too long to list. My dream is to have a 525 kilo car that outwardly looks like it has been untouched. Hope to have it done by the end of 2005, by which time I'll have had my fun with the little 1800 Zetec and it will be time to move up to a Duratec when prices and availabilty may be better. Hoping to get the car accurately weighed soon to see what kind of a task it really is and if it's acheiveable at all. A man has got to have a hobby after all 😬 AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey UC Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 I’ve just had the axle out to replace some of the bushes on the rear suspension, but noticed the Ital axle has some huge lugs which presumably attached it to a leaf spring under a Morris Ital at some time in its past. Has anybody ground these off, as I bet they must weigh at least a kilo? I also VERY reluctantly reinstalled the hand break, I think it only gets used to pass an MOT (due at some point before Silverstone) and the live axle version with the steel rod connecting the two drum breaks is a pretty heavy piece of apparatus. I’ve been thinking about replacing it with a cable only operated version, has anybody else done this ? Mikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Ammo, Only Kidding 😬 I have though of doing the same, but as yet have not had the time! I admire your dedication and look forward to your results. Greg, Q 86 NTM (Green 185BHP XF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elie boone Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Mikey, i have a cable operated hand brake on a Ford LX i do not have the streghtening plate because i use the 5 link set up. I always cut bolts that are to long, not only to save weight but i find it dodgy a bolt that is to long. BTW all non stress bolts are ali or plastic ( rear wings) and i hope to see 480kg when i weigh my seven even less whould be great but if its 500 or more i throw my sigaret in the fuel reservoir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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