3J - NXG plate LSD - NOW CANCELLED see last post

[7 wonders of the world]

I've been speaking with Dan Jones at 3J   http://www.3jdriveline.com   to see if there was the possibility of him offering a Bulk Buy for club members on their new range of SCCR gearkits and NXG plate LSD's, that offer several features and benefits not available with other brands.
 
LSD Product detail:
'New' 3J Driveline Ltd Designed and manufactured NXG Lsd. The strongest, most progressive and versatile LSD unit in the market place. The 3J plate pack always run with 8 active surfaces, even in our lighter settings, giving maximum surfaces and surface area contact during use. Our new pre-load spacer helps generate the pre-load. Rather than just have the 2 or 3 settings of other units, we can 'fine tune' to particular pre-load settings complemented with our choice of ramps, to get the perfect LSD set up for you. The Bevel and planet gear pack has been designed to be the smoothest mesh, biggest and strongest tooth profile and pins that we have ever been involved with. Eliminating the rattle, and excessive back lash of other units. Also With the added benefit of dual ramps.
 
Dual Ramps available are 30/90, 40/90, 30/60, 45/45, 50/90, plus more by request.
 
Preload can be set from 0-150 lb/ft
 
LSD:
7" Sierra supply only £635 + VAT RRP
 
Rebuilding into your existing final drive, includes strip, blast clean casing rebuilding with new bearings seals etc and all clearences set correctly cost in addition to LSD £250 + VAT

 

 
Gear Kit Product detail:
Manufactured from upgraded material and designed with competition in mind the 3J performance kits take these Classic transmissions to another level.
Choose from a choice of ratios for any application.
 The main shaft or speed gears are coated with a high performance coating to aid oil absorption and increase life span, 1st and 2nd gears run on bearing races with caged needle rollers. 
Unique milled pockets on the face of the gears and oil scrolls throughout the bore lubricate the gears like no other kits do.
These kits use a different tooth profile, size and machining process compared to the older Tran X sets resulting in strnger, quieter gearset.

A Selection of Ratios available are listed on the website, 
 
Gear kits:
supply only  £975 + VAT  RRP

Gearboxs:
These include new seals, gaskets, bearings and baulk rings throughout both options include a forged one piece selector and alloy lid with breather
Gearbox Iron case £1495 + VAT   RRP
Gearbox Alloy case £1950 + VAT  RRP

NB These prices are based on supplying your own type 9 for rebuild an additional surcharge of £200 + VAt will be applied if no box is supplied. 
 
 
Discount:
Based on a mixed order of 10 units (LSD, Gear Kit or Gearbox) we would see a discounts of:
 
LSD                      20% which equates to   £508 + VAT
Gear Kit              15% which equates to   £829 + VAT
Gearbox (iron)   15% which equates to   £1271 + VAT
Gearbox (alloy)  15% which equates to   £1657 + VAT
 
 
I will look into shipping etc when we have a better idea of interest levels.
 
In order to reduce the number of email questions to 3J, I've been asked if the questions could be directed to me, either post on here or BM me please in order I answer them or collate and ask in a more orderly fashion.
 
Since the Type 9 is probably one of the most widely used boxes in motorsport if you know someone outside the club who is interested please direct them this way in order that we all benefit, Westy owners, Mallocks, rally boys in the Mk2's etc
 
Could you please post interest below indicating if your interested in a LSD, Gear Kit or Gearbox so I can get a feel for numbers.
 
If anyone want a Excel version for gear calcs etc I have one where tyre size, final drive ration etc can all be tweeked to show shift points, rpm drop, speed etc - please BN me and I'll send a copy of mine over, you can play till your hearts content which the raft of ratios on offer!
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

[johnnyseven]

The LSD - has anyone had one fitted in a seven?--any feed back if they have?

[7 wonders of the world]

I and many others used the previous Tran X version which was fantastic, the NXG has evolved taking the design forward again, unlike other brands which are just copies of older plate designs.

The fact that there are 3 suitable ramps which arreally useable in a 7 30/90 40/90 50/90 gives you a grrat choice and again the preload will be custom set for you preference too anywhere from 0-150lb/ft.

[johnnyseven]

Ok - I'm interested. 

[Garth]

Does anyone know what road and race think about these LSD's?

[Albert Donaldson]

Excuse my ignorance. Could you please expand on or explain what effects the differing ramp angles and preload have. I am considering lsd but seem to be baffled by choice at the moment.

thanks,

Albert

[7 wonders of the world]

Hi Albert,

Ramps:

This is the dynamic loading applied to the clutch packs by the application of torque.

They are usually expressed in the format of 30/60 40/90 45/45 etc these being in degrees, the first number is the drive ramp, that which operates under acceleration when torque i transferred thro the unit.

The shallower the ramp ie 30 degree the more rapidly the cclmpaing pressure is applied to the clutch pack in the LSD and therefore effectively locking the axle, effectively acting in quite an aggressive manner.

Conversely with the steeper ie 50 degree the clamping force on the clutch pack will be applied at a slower rate making the lock up more progressive.

The second number again in degrees refers to the units operation under coast (overrun) conditions, and in some application aid either braking or handling characteristics, gravel rally cars (RWD) would often use 45/45 in order to help flick the car sideways.

In a Caterham an aggressive coast setting would add considerable understeer in some cases terminal ! so I would look to use a coast setting of 90 degrees - ie no clamping action at all so in overrun it performs as an open diff would and will not hinder turn in.

Consider different conditions and the affect these ramps can have:

Dry fast sweeping corners would easily handle a 30 degree set up clamping quickly in order to maximize the traction as you want to deploy all available horses, however exiting a damp hairpin at Mallory would be different as the transition from open diff at the turn in to power on at the apex could upset the balance as the differential action will suddenly be lost as the clutches clamp quickly and aggressively resulting is a tail slide - however a 50/90 unit offers the same turn in however clamps more progressively allowing the differential action for longer thus keeping the car in line AND going forward not sideways - thus by tuning the LSD you can gain a significant competitive advantage.

Preload:

This is the static clamping load applied to the clutch pack expressed in lb/ft, the higher the number the more preload is present and so there will be an inbuilt resistance to turning the car in since differential action will only be achieved once this preload has been overcome - again not ideal in a Caterham, the original OE ZF's came with tintop preload of around 70lb/ft !, fine if your driving a 1600Kg German barge but way too tight for one of Colins.

As with normal car set up, track and road are far removed from one another, the first offering the opportunity to practice and learn corners to perfect the line, the second your often driving the corner for the first time, so as with geometry / suspension set up a correct LSD set up will help your turn in accordingly, be that clipping the apex or missing the telegraph pole!

 The 3J NXG units offer ramps in 30/90 40/90 50/90 (other are available but I just listed the 90 coast versions) and a preload from 0-150lb/ft, compared to CC's current OE Titan fitment with 30/90 and 40lb/ft being the only option, though due to the smaller plate area employed this preload does drop off.

Let me know if I can help further

Best regards.

 

[johnnyseven]

How's the numbers looking- ?- great answer above for the uninformed like myself

any idea how long the turnaround would be on a diff?

johnny

[Albert Donaldson]

So if I understand the above correctly a reasonable set up for a caterham used 25/75 road/track would be 40/90 with minimum preload 5?lbs.

[johnnyseven]

As I'm looking for mainly road with an odd track day thrown in I was looking at 50/90 - but did wonder what preload was best?

my diffs out at the weekend - so any news?

[7 wonders of the world]

In a 7 I would only consider using an LSD with a 90 degree coast ramp ie no operation in coast, a 25 degree drive ramp with be very aggressive,

For the road a 50/90 would work well, either way track or road I'd go  for a preload of around 5lbs.

[7 wonders of the world]

Albert,

Apologies I tottaly misread your last post!

for you useage a 40/90 with 5lbs would be ideal,

I only scanned the reply and thought you were looking for a 25/75 degree set up ! 

[7 wonders of the world]

I thought we would of had a lot more interest in this BB,

so far we've got interest for 4 x LSD and a couple of gearkits too,

I assume pennies are tight as you can't all be happy with the ratios Ford choose for hauling a mobile chicane, sorry caravan, with a Sierra .....

 

 

 

[johnnyseven]

Do you think you will get the numbers/ discount? If you do - did we need to contact them directly or ?

im looking to get mine sorted in the next couple of weeks so would like to know if it will happen- any interest from other clubs?

 

 

[7 wonders of the world]

not yet It's on the Facebook page, if you know of any other clubs you have access too please direct them this way

[Albert Donaldson]

Intersested in LSD 40/90 with 5lbs preload, parts only.

[7 wonders of the world]

OK Just spoken with Dan, and he's happy to go ahead even though we have lower numbers, so I'll BM each of you for details,

Payment will be made direct to 3J - which makes things easier,

So far we have,

Garth, Johnny Seven  and Albert looking at LSD's

and a couple offline looking at gearkits and another LSD too.

Anymore interest please drop your details here 

 

[7 wonders of the world]

After the initial Bulk Buy several memebers found a number of issues regarding the design of the LSD unit resulting in 75% of the members returning their LSD for a full refund.

I was in communication with Dan and had hoped that these issues could be resolved however it was not the case.

I am currently pursuing another avenue with a well respected transmission company based in Redditch to come back to me with a price on his own LSD design which I have pushed to get into production having seen the developement versions several times over the last 5 years, all of which as been spent testing in race applications.

As soon as I have more details I will post in a new thread.

Best regards.