Wheel bearing?

[MereCat]

Just doing some pre flight checks....

 

Just put some air in front offside tyre and thought check for wheel wobble so north / south movement and noticed some play as of the nuts had not been tightened enough or the wheel was not quite seated true before doing nuts up. It's not much maybe a mm but enough to move..SO

 

Could it be as suspected in subject heading?

 

Not putting on properly ?

 

Or normal ?

 

Should say have been getting a squeak from that wheel for some time but stops usually when dab brakes.

 

It's a 97 year S3.

 

Any help before tomorrow am ( want a run out to work) would be appreciated.

 

Is it safe to drive?

 

Thanks

 

[Jonathan Kay]

Take it off. Inspect. Clean all points of contact. Put it back on.

 

Still the same?

 

Jonathan

[MereCat]

Thanks for the reply Jonathan.

 

Sadly no jack aside from the antiquated one that comes with the 7 and I don't know what I have done with that??

 

Could get one from the daily but would not know ( first time) where to place this?

[Wrightpayne]

Wheel bearings are adjustable - mucho in the archives.

 

Edited to say mine had play in the bearing when I checked it for the MOT and had probably been like it for a while.

 

Your post reads as if the wheel nuts were loose. I takes it's 'like' they are loose!

 

Regards

 

Ian

 

Edited by - Wrightpayne on 24 Jul 2014 22:34:36

[Jonathan Kay]

Ah... that's play while on the ground? No, it's not safe until you know what's happening.

 

Does the jack you can get to have arms that stick out on both sides and a flat bit on top where it lifts the car?

 

Where are you?

 

Jonathan

[MereCat]

West Wycombe

 

Ian it's does move slightly..sorry if misleading from description.

 

It's as if the wheel and the area where it sits is slightly warped I.e. it has a very small amount of play?

 

East / west no movement. Other side is fine.

 

Make sense or have I described it ok already?

 

Thanks

[MereCat]

Have jack. ..I am guessing usual jack point from of car on cross points?

[Wrightpayne]

East / west play is masked by the steering movement.

 

Mine only needed the bearing nut tightening by about 1/12 th of a turn to remedy. When the car was on the ground and I shook the wheel you could hear it knocking!!

 

Is it the scissor jack in the tool kit or a trolley jack. If a scissor I'd only trust it for checking - I wouldn't fancy doing any work on the car with just this!

 

Ian

[MereCat]

Its the bearing ☹️

 

I am hoping its as you say possible to fix?

 

Not too sure what I need to do here ...shall search archives.

 

So shall need a proper jack and some guidance.

 

Gutted but glad I caught it.

[Smiffy69]

Don't panic as it's a really easy fix

 

Jack up the car and stick it on axle stands ( health and safety never has a day off)

Remove wheel

In the centre of the hub you will see a big castle nut with a split pin through it

Remove split pin and tighten nut until play in bearing had gone but hub assembly should still move freely and easily and as said above is only about a 1/12th of a turn

Ensure that you can see the hole for the split pin to go back in

Put in pin

Stick wheel back on

Check again

 

Jobs a good un

 

It should only take 10 mins

 

Good luck

[Tony Whitley]

Two things - there is a dust cap over the castellated nut that can be an 🙆🏻 to get off; having tightened up the bearing undo the nut to the nearest point you can get the split pin in, it should not be tight.

[john milner]

Personally I have only ever checked wheel bearings while the car is jacked up. Can they be reliably checked with the car on the ground or would play when on the ground indicate something more serious?

[MereCat]

Gents,

 

Thanks for all your help so far.

 

John could you elaborate on what more serious might be please chap?

 

I shall have a go today , off to buy a shiny new jack and then work out what it could be IF not the bearing. Try this first and then whatever more serious is?

 

Thanks

 

Edited by - MereCat on 26 Jul 2014 08:35:07

[Jonathan Kay]

Quoting MereCat: 

Try this first and then whatever more serious is?

Don't worry about this. Get it safely up on stands, not just a jack, and start investigating.

 

Jonathan

[Wrightpayne]

MC

 

 

There are a number of other potential issues though in most cases it simply needs adjusting:-

 

1) bearing fubar'd

2) cracked hub (race cars mainly)

3) steel bearing outer race spinning in alloy hub causing wear and play.

 

2 & 3 needs a new hub.

 

One of the most important things to remember is not to over tighten the nut adjusting the bearing. When I used to help dad service his Marina's he used to describe the play as just perceptible.

 

I don't want to worry you, but I also recall him telling me of a colleague who's bearings friction welded themselves to the stub axel as the garage had over tightened

 

Regards

 

Ian

[Tony Whitley]

Call that scary? That's scary.

 

Not a job to take on alone if you have no experience as seems to be the case here.

[DJ.]

While it is important not to overtighten the bearing, it is worth checking that it is tight enough to stop the inner races spinning on the stub axle. This is easy to see with just the wheel centre cap removed.

 

Duncan

[MereCat]

As per Jonathan's suggestion I have moved the other related thread for this across to here. I should have posed the question here

 

Smiffy thanks also for your reply I was thinking thinners or maybe white spirit instead ,Although I do have some for the mower...

 

Can't cut and paste your reply on there.

 

My initial post from other thread...

 

Some of you will have seen my post for hub bearing which I am presently in the process of checking and greasing.

 

The questions is does anyone know if this would have come greased already when supplied in kit form?

 

If yes , what grease would this have been ? 97 S3 .

 

Could possibly have been greased again in its time which raises a further question of

 

I have read that it is not good to grease previously greased bearings IF you don't use the same grease as before as this can cause the current grease to break down and then leak?

 

About to purchase Castrol LM as prescribed by a knowledgeable chap. I don't have an option to ask this arvo so thought I would ask the POBC ( who are not out enjoying the weather) ...Anyone there?

 

Thanks

[MereCat]

I should also say now that I have the 7 on jack ( with stands...H&S)

 

Noticed some play on near side also which as you have said is normal. The offside does move a lot more though so gonna crack on with removing a checking.

 

JK wiggled the actual thing without the wheel attached with a slight movement.

 

Now have LM grease but open to replies before I do clean out. I always thought it was a sealed unit but I guess I was wrong.

 

Thanks

[Roadsport06]

Many people have had their car from new without grease in the bearings.

Castrol LM is a bearing grease so is fine.

Since you are getting the bearings checked then clean them off and gwork the new grease in.

[Jonathan Kay]

How's it going?

 

Jonathan

[MereCat]

Done

 

I have to say thank you to all that assisted. I spent 3 Hours yesterday afternoon stripping, cleaning and rebuilding with the guiding hand of BIO. John BIG thanks for your help and showing me the steps first hand.

 

Really enjoyed it and having inspected the bearing it was fine. Checked stub axle and fine. Seems it was just nipping up that was required but for peace of mind it was stripped, cleaned (bearing in petrol) ( main part with disc attached) with lots of towel etc.

 

Process was ( as I remember it)

 

Loosen wheel

Jack up front of car

Remove wheel

Reseat wheel ( check that it was not just seated wrong) All ok

Remove wheel ( again)

Remove brake pads ( remove both clips and locating pins and then slide out pads.

Ensure do not mix up inner and outer pads as need to go back as before.

Remove 2 bolts holding calliper ( located inner side, might need breaker bar, ensure don't lose spring and spacer washers ).

Remove Calliper ( careful not to stretch brake line) and place on box or something to rest while working on bearing.

Using hammer and flat bladed screwdriver tap either side of dust cover ( 12 and 6 or 3 and 9 position) until loose and take off ( should be full as grease as reservoir ).

Now look for tightness of nut ( will have split pin in it).

If loose follow instructions as per this thread I.e. remove pin and turn until finger tight ensuring can see the whole to replace NEW split pin (ideally don't reuse old as can break having been bent before).

DON'T over tighten to find hole to locate. Better loosen as will expand when hot ( running too tight can cause friction weld) and likely other damage.

If nipped tighten to finger tight and then locate new split pin.

Spin wheel to ensure running free.

 

IF packing with new grease then remove pin.

Find suitable plastic box to place parts and wash in

Undo nut and remove ensuring kept away from any dirt.

Remove D washer ( check for grooving, turn around if required)

This will only come out straight so might need 2 small flat bladed screwdrivers.

Keep washer away from dirt and pop in plastic box to wash.

Now remove bearing outer , again place in box to wash.

Now remove rest of disc / wheel assembly which will then show stub axle.

Some 7's have a felt washer on the back of assembly (this is the bit I can't remember) mind had a rubber washer fitted which was handy as the felt ones can get damaged.

Place this on a bench (workmate) or two pieces of wood to raise from ground level

Remove bearing outer locating collar ( ring circumference of hub) and place in plastic box to clean

With a rounded blunt object tap out inner bearing and place into plastic box to clean

Now the mucky bit.....

Using gloves and fingers scoop out all of the grease from inside assembly. Take care NOT to use anything metallic or get crap inside it.

Clean with kitchen towel and cloth until all grease is removed

Now pour some petrol or thinners into plastic box ( remove plastic gloves first as melts them )

Using a old toothbrush clean out all old grease and then dry with towel / cloth or compressed air if you have a compressor.

Check bearing rollers for pitting or blue colour ( overheating)

If you find this best to fit new bearing

Now check collar on inside of assembly.

If you can see vertical scoring then its wearing .

Now to begin reassembly....

grease with new grease.

Begin with assembly ensuring inner collar has plenty of grease

Grease bearing ( ensure work new grease in and is covered)

Place in assembly located in collar

Fit locating collar

Before placing assembly back on stub axle clean off all old grease ( if any on it) but do not great this again.

Place assembly on and then place other part of bearing having greased as before working into rollers. Tell sign is old darker grease coming out ( if your that fussy).

Now fit nut and tighten finger tight finding hole to locate split pin.

Check wheel runs free and little north / south ( 12oclock and 6 o'clock movement) normal to get some play.

Locate split pin

Grease dust cap and then fit ( normal for some grease to come out of hold at top of cap)

Refit calliper and pads ( torque 2 nuts 56nm)

Fit wheel and check for play

Lower and torque wheel nuts (75nm) ( have 8 spoke wheels)

Check for movement on ground ( should be none or very little)

 

Done!

 

Road test and then test for play again while on ground.

Jack up and test as before left.

 

I am sure the experts while fill in the gaps if I have missed something. Thanks again and I hope this is some use to someone in the future

 

[Jonathan Kay]

:-)

 

Well done, and it's always good to hear of helpers.

 

Jonathan