Steve Causey Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 So my 2005 ex-Academy car, which is used for sprinting, won't start. Symptoms are as follows: * Ignition on - can hear fuel pump running. * Turn to start position - starter turns over very slowly and engine won't start. * Repeated attempts result in starter getting even slower. All of which suggest battery. However: * I installed a Varley Red Top 25 three and a half years ago. Responses to an earlier post suggest that it's unusual for them to fail so quickly. * When in the garage it's always connected to a charger/conditioner. * Conditioner indicates that the battery is fully charged. * 20 mins or so after attempting to start the car as described above and then reconnecting the conditioner it again shows fully charged. * Talked to the Varley DMS guys. They said to fully charge the battery, disconnect the charger and check the voltage 8 hours later (checking immediately after charging can give false results apparently). They said should be 12.8V or above. I'm seeing 12.9V using a meter. So is it the battery or has the starter motor given up? Or is there something else wrong? As far as I can tell all the connections and leads are ok. Sorry for the long post! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Can you get another car alongside & try a jump start? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colindavies56 Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 have you tried jumping off another car or get a jump lead,one end on back of starter,other end on battery+,it now has 12v straight up its arse,so it should start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stationary M25 Traveller Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Measure voltage across battery when standing ... and while cranking starter. See how low it drops. Much below something like 9V and the ECU won't let it start. However ... check the connections of all the fat cables ... red and black. There will be earth cables (black) from battery to engine and engine to chassis. Every chance that one has some corrosion which will cause a high resistance. Undo each and clean then up to shiny metal before refixing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted January 29, 2014 Author Share Posted January 29, 2014 Thanks for the quick response guys. No haven't tried jumping it from another car. If it starts that would point to the battery. If it does the same thing again that would suggest starter motor - correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Ford Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Quoting Steve Causey: Thanks for the quick response guys. No haven't tried jumping it from another car. If it starts that would point to the battery. If it does the same thing again that would suggest starter motor - correct? Probably, but could also be rubbish jump leads (there are some terrible ones around) or poor connection between the battery and the starter motor (eg. a problem with the FIA switch). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted January 29, 2014 Author Share Posted January 29, 2014 Thanks Roger. Pretty sure my leads would fall in the 'terrible' category! Any suggestions who makes good ones?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Richard Price Posted January 29, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted January 29, 2014 Steve, Do you have a master switch? If so, I'd try disconnecting the battery leads and joining them together (or fix them both to the same post on the switch? Have you removed and cleaned the battery to engine earth lead connections? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shn7 Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 As above re big cables and FIA switch. As a first check on the latter try holding the key into the on position while trying the starter. Symptoms suggest poor connection not allowing enough juice to get to the starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted January 29, 2014 Author Share Posted January 29, 2014 Thanks for all the suggestions. My work plan is: * Clean all the connections * Try Steve's suggestion re holding the master switch * Try Richards suggestion re the switch wiring * Buy some decent jump leads! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shn7 Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Don't forget to add battery voltages to that list, no load and cranking as Ian suggested above. Good luck and let us know the solution when you find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Ford Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Jump leads: You ideally want copper, but copper-coated aluminium seems to get getting popular. Depending on your budget, these on Amazon look good at the high end, or for a cheaper option these on ebay (though note the postage). No direct knowledge of either, but they look OK from the specs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stationary M25 Traveller Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 .... eBay ..... only Tools n Horses !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted January 30, 2014 Author Share Posted January 30, 2014 Thanks Roger. Ordered the more expensive ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Day Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 My starter was reconditioned in 2006 & worked perfectly until last summer. Similar symptoms & would even start the engine with the help of a big, big jump start battery. Took the starter off & fitted my spare. Now starts 1st time. So if the battery is OK & you're sure the wiring is in good order............... Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 For a 2005 Academy car (mine is a 2004), I would certainly be checking the earth connections - one on the offside engine mount, one on the nearside. FIA switches are also a good checkpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpbransfield Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 Steve, Had the same problem 2 years ago. Battery fully charged and on a conditioner. Checked it with a battery meter from the local garage that showed it was not quite 100 per cent. New battery and it started first time. It was a two year old Banner. Been fine ever since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted February 4, 2014 Author Share Posted February 4, 2014 Update. Voltage on cranking is in the range 6 to 7 volts so I think the battery's knackered. Haven't tried jumping yet (waiting for decent leads to a arrive) but have cleaned all the connections on the 'thick' cables. Bit disappointed that the Varley only lasted 3 1/2 years. Based on feedback to earlier post Odyssey seem to be the ones to go for. Is the PC680 Extreme 25 the one I need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shn7 Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 Looks like you've found the source of the problem there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myothercarsa2cv Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 I use an Ultramax from eBay... They used to be a lot cheaper but are still probably slightly cheaper in terms of £/yr. My first one lasted 2.5years until the casing cracked. The Ultramax NP20-12 (20Ah), Odyssey PC680 (18Ah) and Varley Red Top 25 (16Ah) are all very similar in size (with the Odyssey being a few mm larger each way than the other two), so all should fit the same battery box/cage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Causey Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 Just to close this out, a new Odyssey battery seems to have fixed it. Thanks for all for the help and advice. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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