Guest Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Hi all, New to the forum and to the Caterham scene. Have ordered an R500 to build which arrives at the beginning of Feb this year and looking for help / tips etc... Here's the story so far:- A good friend of mine has an R300 which I've driven plenty of times and throughly enjoyed driving. Was going to build myself a remote control car over the winter, and having built some 1/5th scale off road cars in the past I couldn't find anything of interest that was large enough satisfy my needs of building something massive... So... To cut a long story short, after a few beers down the pub one night back in September last year (2013) my arm got twisted into agreeing that I really should build a kit car... Rang Caterham south on the Monday morning, but no sales rep was available to take my call... So, slightly un-impressed, I called the midlands branch and ended up speaking to Doug Parker, who I believe is fairly new there and it transpires he commutes about 1 mile from where I live all the way up to Leicester every day - which is no mean feat... Downloaded the price list, and specced myself up a nice R300 with a few goodies, however my mate with the R300 suggested he'd much rather have an R400 if he got another car, so I quickly realised I may aswell go for the R400 and get some of the other 'goodies' included in the price. So once in the R400 'column' on the price list I added a few more 'goodies' and thought that is was quite close to an R500 price, and for the difference I should really go with an R500... Spoke to Doug, and he said I couldn't get the R500 in kit form, so I'd have to go with the R400 (which wasn't quite what I wanted) something to do with the fact there isn't a build manual for the R500 and the last person that built an R500 didn't set the carbs (or something) up properly, blew it up and then blamed Caterham?!? Nevertheless, not one to take 'no you can't have that one' too easily, I pushed Doug and he spoke to someone back at HQ, then came back to me and said it was OK to get the R500 (manual box) in kit form, so long as I signed a disclaimer, knew that the instruction manual would only be an R400 one, and that Caterham wanted to setup the carbs.... I was very happy with that, so was just a case of deciding what colour to go for, and what to do for the next 5 months until the bits arrived! A few calls to Doug, to confirm order specs and other bits had passed, and then I got a call from him… He said that there was a free track day to have a go in the 620R… I thought for about, errrr, a nano second before I said “ok, I’m in, where, when” It was at Donington Park on 3rd November 2013… Got up to Donington Park about 8am, had a bacon bap, the usual briefing and then off to have a go in a Supersport R. Great (or at least I thought) until I went out in it, and for one reason or another the car was extremely twitchy and I was left thinking, hmmm what have I done? I don’t remember Andy’s R300 being like this… Anyway didn’t really enjoy it, and when I got out I spoke to the other drivers who were there (one was an academy racer) and they all had a similar complaint about it… Hung around for a bit whilst some of the other drivers went for their spins (one quite literally) in the 620R, before it was my go… The car came in and I was like cool - here we go, however, some marshals instantly flocked around the car and then advised Greg(?) and Doug from Caterham that the car was too noisy and had been black flagged - great! Anyway, Greg and Doug done some pleading with the staff who were running the track day and they allowed the car back onto the circuit so long as it was short shifted, with the proviso that if the car went over the db limit again it was an instant ‘time to go home’ moment. Having this said to me just before my go was quite irritating as i wanted to give it the full beans, but didn’t want to ruin everyone else’s chances of having a go. Went out and instantly felt at home in it, seemed much more compliant and like the R300 I’d driven before, so i was chuffed to bits. Video link to footage here Left Donington park thinking that the 620R was the car i now ‘needed’… Spoke to Doug on the monday and it was a ‘no chance’ of you having that to build, so don’t even bother thinking about it… and you won’t get it until May 2014 at the very earliest, plus it was a lot of money, so had to ‘stick’ with the R500 So… The R500 arrives in about 3 weeks... My garage is ready, all tools are ready & waiting, then there's me… A complete novice kit car builder (who likes to bite off more than he can chew and work his way through it) is kinda ready, but a little daunted at the same time… Looking for help and tips off anyone who has built... any pitfalls, what to look out for, any quirks I should be looking out for on the R500 and so on really. Thanks in advance, Daniel. Edited by - Roadracer1977 on 11 Jan 2014 20:13:37 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Interesting intro, welcome :) R500 hasn't got carbs by the way, or any new a caterham, so not sure what that chap is talking about. There's no tuning to be done at all, just bolt everything together and the ECU will control fuel delivery via the injectors and the throttle bodies. Edited by - Peter De La Mare on 11 Jan 2014 19:05:43 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Welcome to the club. Your build will be interesting so please keep us updated. I built my caterham a little over six years ago but it is at the other end of the pecking order from yours! Home built R500's are rare, there was one a while ago that had zero oil pressure on it's first start up. Edited by - Martin Jeffrey on 11 Jan 2014 20:22:01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3MCJez Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Martin - that may be the one referred to in the first post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSA Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 After reading your post it might be be wiser to getting a Motorsport company like Foulds or Hyperion or the like to build the car for you.Sorry To be brutally honest i think its beyond you Edited by - BSA on 11 Jan 2014 20:33:14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Quoting Martin Jeffrey: Welcome to the club. Your build will be interesting so please keep us updated. I built my caterham a little over six years ago but it is at the other end of the pecking order from yours! Home built R500's are rare, there was one a while ago that had zero oil pressure on it's first start up. Edited by - Martin Jeffrey on 11 Jan 2014 20:22:01 Ok... Will be posting pics and progress as I go... Is there a build blog of the R500 you mention? (Or any others...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Quoting Martin Jeffrey: Welcome to the club. Home built R500's are rare, there was one a while ago that had zero oil pressure on it's first start up. Edited by - Martin Jeffrey on 11 Jan 2014 20:22:01 Welcome to the mad house That was human error I understand during build, not an engine quality problem. Yours will have the Raceline DS so theres only 2 oil line connections which are clearly marked on the sump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetec Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Welcome, Nothing like jumping in the deep end!!! Still you wont need to upgrade from an R500 Enjoy the build & I think caterham want to balance the throttle bodies ( bit like carbs) otherwise it will run rough. If in any doubt have a few members there to help you start the beast! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stationary M25 Traveller Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Welcome aboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ. Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Welcome There are some great tips in this thread here When you get the front uprights, don't assume they have been greased properly, I did , and I've just fitted new bearings after 12,000 miles ☹️ Search blatchat and you'll find lost of great advice. Duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3MCJez Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Quoting BSA: After reading your post it might be be wiser to getting a Motorsport company like Foulds or Hyperion or the like to build the car for you.Sorry To be brutally honest i think its beyond you Edited by - BSA on 11 Jan 2014 20:33:14 Do you think an R500 is more difficult to build than an Academy car? I knew next to nothing before I built mine. All is built previously was 1/10 RC kits and Ikea furniture! Jez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSA Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 No not at all but slightly more expensive if you cock it up and there have been a few that have. I have been in to quite a few Motorsport workshops and seen many a home build's that leave a lot be desired and Factory cars for that matter, Now that he has been made aware that an R500 doesn't run on Carb's i guess it will be plain sailing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative bluenose Posted January 11, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted January 11, 2014 Dizz built a R500 SV a while back and Nigel Pugh built one although he had problems connecting his dry sump and the engine failed I believe. This may be the one he was referring to 🤔 both these builders were experienced in building Caterhams. Not sure why a R400 with a dry sump would be any different to building a R500 or for that matter an R300 with a dry sump. Good luck, take your time and don't turn the engine over without someone checking your work who has experience as having signed the disclaimer you could end up with a large bill if the engine fails due to incorrect installation - I am sure it will be fine though. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 wonders of the world Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 If you not familiar with the cars as it seems I'd recommend you trailer the car to have a post build check carried out prior to IVA, use CC, Millwood or one of the Caterham race teams, by trailering it your not exposing yourself or others to incident, just in case you may not have assembled everything 100% correctly - I'm thinking suspension steering and brakes in particular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grubbster Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 something to do with the fact there isn't a build manual for the R500 In my experience there isn't really a build manual for the other variants either The build manuals are never kept up to date but I suppose they give you a few clues on where most bits fit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Starting with an R500 if you have no previous experience with a Caterham is brave. Starting with a 620R would be silly. TAKE TRAINING. Otherwise we may well have another serious accident. Even in the dry it may very well be interesting to put down the loud pedal in the dry if the tyres are cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Plato Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 interesting the shift in attitude within the club on home build 😬 what's the differnce between a dry sumped R400 and a dry dumped R500 ?... cams , pistons , throttle bodies ?? calibrating the throttle bodies is well documented . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James.S Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 RR, congrats, the 500 is stunning. Don't worry about the build it is straightforward. I believe that Nigel was given the wrong info from CC about his which resulted in the issue. Drop him a line on PH, he will fill you in and is happy to give advise. Several things are a must, 1. Speak to CC and make sure the tunnel and pedal box are insulated as per the R300 race car. 2. If you are tracking it, get extra rims and setup in ZZR's for dry & ZZS's for wet. 3. Whatever tyres you go for get it set up by a race team once you have finished. 4. Get some tuition, simian mason.com is great in caterhams. 5. Road or track...... Put a superlight race cage on it!! Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Would like to say thanks to those with the positive and helpful contributions, the links you have submitted have been of great assistance already and are giving me something to read whilst I wait for those last 'few' weeks to pass Quoting BSA: Now that he has been made aware that an R500 doesn't run on Carb's i guess it will be plain sailing. Seeing as you've been such a great help so far... I don't suppose you'll be able to help when it comes to the cup holder install would you? Quoting Dave Jackson: what's the differnce between a dry sumped R400 and a dry dumped R500 ?... cams , pistons , throttle bodies ?? calibrating the throttle bodies is well documented . Do you have a link to any info regarding the calibration of the throttle bodies? I've searched the forum, but not found much.. Quoting James.S: RR, congrats, the 500 is stunning. Don't worry about the build it is straightforward. I believe that Nigel was given the wrong info from CC about his which resulted in the issue. Drop him a line on PH, he will fill you in and is happy to give advise. Yes I'm already in touch with Nigel and he has been very helpful to date, but thank you anyway. A couple of points you raised I'd like some clarification on tho... Quoting James.S: 1. Speak to CC and make sure the tunnel and pedal box are insulated as per the R300 race car. Can you elaborate on this please? Or provide further info? Quoting James.S: 3. Whatever tyres you go for get it set up by a race team once you have finished. this was on the list of things to do anyway - do you know of any companies around my area who are 7 specialists in this field? I live in Stevenage, Hertfordshire. Quoting James.S: Enjoy! Goes without saying I'm sure ... but thanks anyway! Edited by - Roadracer1977 on 12 Jan 2014 13:07:26 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted January 12, 2014 Leadership Team Share Posted January 12, 2014 Quoting Roadracer1977: Do you have a link to any info regarding the calibration of the throttle bodies? I've searched the forum, but not found much.. I think you've got plenty to keep you busy before you need to start on the throttle bodies! But anyway ... balancing, throttle setup, throttle potentiometer. When you get to that stage it'll be worth getting a specialist to do it for you prior to heading for the postbuild check. And welcome Stu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mav Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Part f the agreement is Caterham want to set up the tb's so he need not worry, if he wants to keep the warranty, he will need to let them do it. Welcome aboard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Quoting mav: Part f the agreement is Caterham want to set up the tb's so he need not worry, if he wants to keep the warranty, he will need to let them do it. Welcome aboard! Thanks and yes - this is what they mentioned... The agreement is they want to send an engineer to my house to do this part (which I'll have to pay for) but so long as the warranty remains intact, I'm happy however, any info so I can 'swot up' in the meantime would be helpful. Some other questions that have arisen:- 1. I see some people saying about coating the underside of the arches with protection / protective coating - any recommendations? 2. I'm having the nose, sides, rear arches and rear carbon stone chip protectors armourfended - when would the best time to get this done be, straight away, at a certain point during the build? Anyone have experience with this, recommendations would be helpful. Thanks.. Edited by - Roadracer1977 on 12 Jan 2014 16:12:34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative bluenose Posted January 12, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted January 12, 2014 1. You won't need it as you will have carbon wings plus it adds unwanted weight. 2. Keep the nose and wings bare carbon so no armour fend required. Just get the sides done. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Quoting bluenose: 1. You won't need it as you will have carbon wings plus it adds unwanted weight. ok thanks, appreciate your comments... Is this the general consensus? Quoting bluenose: 2. Keep the nose and wings bare carbon so no armour fend required. Just get the sides done. Was something I had considered, but I decided on a paint job that included having the rear arches and nosecone painted (pics will follow when it is delivered) - so would still like to know when the best time to get this done would be...? Thanks in advance Edited by - Roadracer1977 on 12 Jan 2014 19:41:54 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James.S Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 You need to insulate the tunnel and pedal box. CC do a kit then in addition we use the gold reflective stuff from DT. Works a treat. J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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