Is the heated windscreen switched or permanent?

[Hanslow]

Hopefully and a quicky that will put my mind at rest. Is the heated windscreen in a 57 plate Sigma 125 a permanent feed or ignition switched? I used the screen for the first time proper tonight, but stupidly(?) left it on after killing the lights and ignition. Came back to the car and would barely turn over. Ended up having to bump start it to get going (no other choices immediately around :( ).

 

Wondering if it's down to me having left the heated windscreen switch in the on position, or whether it's something else. Started fine this morning, and also for the journey made this evening on the outward leg.

[Stationary M25 Traveller]

Sure they are switched with the ignition. Best to leave engine running for a few minutes after turning all lights and ancillaries off.

[Hanslow]

Thanks. Doesn't sound good then. The car's generally kept on the Optimate between uses (which aren't frequent enough by other people's standards) and I'd have thought the run over from Derbyshire to Lincoln today would have kept it topped nicely (no electrics in use on the way over). The journey this evening was about three miles to more family, which had me putting the lights and heated screen on (to demist), then the poorly car incident when aiming to head back to other Lincoln family.

 

Planning to (hopefully!) get back to Derbyshire tonight from Lincoln. Fingers crossed that'll be ok and then I can start checking out the alternator and battery tomorrow with the multimeter. I'd have thought if the battery was on its way out, it'd be a bit more catastrophic (from experience), but still new to some Caterham foibles.

[Sheds Moderator]

It sounds like a sick battery. IME they are rarely at catastrophic as that - at least at first. You get a fail-to-start and then after a bump they limp about for a bit sounding lazy, then they toss their hand in again.

 

Stuff like screen heaters should always be wired through the ignition switch for exactly the reason you state. There is no possible need to run a heated screen without the engine on, so it's switched off with the ignition to stop you flattening the battery when you (inevitably) leave it switched on.

 

I carry jumpleads in any car, especially one with a Banner.

[Johnty Lyons]

The current drain with headlights and screen heater plus all other normal electrics on a caterham is more than the Alternator can cope with so it does not suprise me with the miniscule std battery in a cat that you will have starting difs after such a run. Well known problem. ☹️ Plus youd just slaughtered said battery by starting car it never got a chance to recover because you immediatly sw on lights and sc heater. Been there done that joys of winter driving in a Caterham. 😬

 

Edited by - Johnty Lyons on 28 Dec 2011 15:27:48

[Alan Reeves]

Jonty if its such an issue and 7 owners aware for so long how come we dont all chyange to a bigger battery....im forgiven as a mere 9 months in ....oh if anyone has put a larger battery in what is the recommendation.

 

alan

[Hanslow]

Thanks all for the excellent advice

 

The car started fine and first time for our journey home. I've not checked the voltages and current across the battery yet both running and off. I'll certainly keep an eye on things with the battery just in case I need to stump up for a new one.

 

I guess having never had cause to use the heated screen before, I'd probably got away with naiive usage at night time. This was the first time we'd had the hood on in ages (wanted to make sure the missus didn't get too cold) and it steamed up a bit with all our effort getting in after so much Christmas pud. So I put the screen on, but left it on for the whole journey rather than turning it off once it had cleared

 

Appreciate all the friendly help and advice, I really should talk to you folks more 😬

[Bricol]

I run mine through winter - heated seats, heated screen, heater, stereo, headlights on in a morning and evening commute, with a Banner - no problems. Alternator, in good nick, is easily capable of powering all that lot.

 

A little used car, or one with a 3 or 4 yr old Banner might be struggling if the run after starting isn't long enough to put the juice back in and it slowly runs down over a few days.

 

Bri

 

 

[Hanslow]

I guess the next question then is what's the best way to check the overall condition of a battery? I know about checking voltages to make sure it's charged ok, and checking the voltage when running to check the alternator is wokring and recharging OK, but other than that, is there anyway to actually check/know how well the battery is performing?

 

The only other time this has happened to me was when before I had my optimate to keep the battery conditioned, and due to me being a fair weather driver along with a bout of bad weather, it had run right down. It still started, but you could tell it was labouring and struggling to kick into life.

[Jonathan Kay]

Quoting Bricol: 

I run mine through winter - heated seats, heated screen, heater, stereo, headlights on in a morning and evening commute, with a Banner - no problems. Alternator, in good nick, is easily capable of powering all that lot.

 

Another thread describes the problem of alternators whose pulley wheels run them too slow to charge at low revs. But AFAIK that would be revealed by the ignition warning light staying on.

 

Jonathan

 

Edited by - Jonathan Kay on 29 Dec 2011 13:56:16

 

Edited by - Jonathan Kay on 29 Dec 2011 13:56:41

[Jonathan Kay]

Deleted because of incompetent duplication

 

Edited by - Jonathan Kay on 29 Dec 2011 13:55:51

[Johnty Lyons]

The Std Banner has little reserve capacity. For a regularly used car this is no problem, however a little used car will struggel in winter on short journeys with all auxiliarys turned on, as the starting drain is not recovered sufficently and alternator is putting most of its output to running aux ccts and precious little left to recover battery 99% of time battery is fit for purpose So why fit bigger /heavier battery for 5% of usage. Just manage it.

JJ

[MacP]

CSR200s and apparently Euro 4 sigmas use 063 size batteries.

 

CSR battery tray

 

and Fig 10a of the handbook (p22 of 46) for a picture of this and 063 battery in situ.

 

I have installed a CSR tray and one of these

Varta C6

in my 21.

 

Why?

1. It always works

2. It only weighs c.4 kg more than the Banner and made my car significantly (arguably infinitely) faster because it actually works 😬. Every time, first time. See 1.

3. I turn the key and the engine starts with a "kawhoom" immediately as opposed to kawuggawuggakehehehehehecoughcoughvoom. Even if it's been left unused for a month (or two).

3. It's a standard size battery available from anywhere as opposed to a lawnmower battery available practically nowhere.

4. The top of the range (in this size) Varta costs about the same as the lawnmower special (ok c.£2.50 more). There are plenty of cheaper choices.

5. It has 520CCA as opposed to the 300CCA the Banner has when new provided that you haven't done anything abusive such as not using the car for a couple of days.

6. It is a sealed unit which comes by post pre-charged as opposed to the Banner where you have to fill it with lovely acid if you need to get it by post (which I did).

 

I could go on.

 

I still have a Banner in my French 7 which lives in a garage permanently attached to an Optimate. I have done several trips over the last few days and it is noticeably poorer at starting in winter.