Nick Woods Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 As a lot of my suspension is being replaced after my crash I may have the option of paying a bit extra and putting a freestyle handling kit on instead of the standard setup. I'm most likely to go for the 'road' kit which has front and rear springs and dampers, front and rear adjustable antirollbars and shims for the de-dion ears (I guess for adjusting toe-in). My car is a 1.6K supersport which I'm going to get widetracked as part of the rebuild. Does anyone have the same setup as this, and what do they think of it ? Nick P8MRA - The green one with red wings. Which is now bent ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philwaters Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 Try Jason's web site - he recently had the kit fitted - likes it. http://www.strangely.org/diary/200208/Freestylehandingkit-fitte.html Phil Waters You mean you can drive these? I thought it was just there to polish 😬 Edited by - philwaters on 8 Oct 2002 13:36:44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Grundy Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 I'm sure Hoopy will be along in a minute waxing lyrical. Looking at the kits at Brands they look impressive enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 From what I can see, the Freestyle suspension kit is considerably cheaper than the factory supplied bilsteins (especially when you consider that they are height adjustable). Therefore, if you are careful in your wording, you should get a few of the upgrades FOC from the insurance. Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Edited by - Graham Sewell on 8 Oct 2002 14:04:53 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 the freestyle stuff is similarly priced to the caterham adjustable setup and ARBs with the advantage that you get adjustable ARBs and damping. The dampers are also better valved. not convinced by the rose joints yet (had to have 7 out of 8 replaced) but we'll see... HOOPY Today I shall be mostly wanting to go for a blat R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 Is the failure of rose joints a well known mode of failure. If so why does James Whiting keep touting it for the bottom of live axle rear dampers as an improvement on reliable rubber bushes? I think in general that I would prefer not to have a perfect solution if I also didn't need to worry about failures. Also, when a rose joint does fail, what happens? Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Grundy Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 Hoopy, Not strictly true. The rear adjustable bar from Caterham is approx £90, the one from freestyle which arguably is better is £185.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 Colin - The freestyle springs/adjustable dampers are cheaper than the caterham springs and ride height only adjustable dampers by a larger amount. especially as you get a good discount for buying it all in one go. Graham - Rose joints can be reliable - most proper race cars use them. My freestyle ones weren't reliable. I can't draw any conclusions from that. well, i don't know of any others that have had problems with them so i guess i might just have had a bad batch... HOOPY Today I shall be mostly wanting to go for a blat R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordy Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 any comparisons of the freestyle (avo) dampers with leda dampers from james whiting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morls Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 I cannot speak of the performance yet but the cost difference is substantial between the options... Ledas for mine were about £460 + springs ( £100?) +vat (£100?) A quote for Nitrons was over £600 The Freestyle single adjustable Dampers with threaded spring seats and springs were £405 delivered, arrived when they were suppsed to and Karen likes the colour of the bushes. They all seem good value compared to aftermarket bike shocks at £500+ each Mark Still not 'spotted' ☹️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Grundy Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 Excuse my ignorance and I'm playing devils advocate here, but as nice and appealing the freestyle handling kit looks, is this a real leap forward in handling panasea, and are there really any significant advantages to be had by spending large chunks of moolah on this kit or any other latest gizmos. I suppose my point is, would it be better to go back to basics and concentrate your efforts (and cash) by sorting out the handling by flat flooring for instance or optimising wheel and tyre choice. Dont get me wrong I am as impressed with the kit as anyone else, and I came away from Brands dreaming of a freestyle handling, Duratec powered seven, but I'm just wandering if we get blinded by technology rather than simply maximising what we have. God I talk some crap sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Woods Posted October 8, 2002 Author Share Posted October 8, 2002 my thoughts exactly , which is why I asked the question. Unusually for me I kept it fairly short this time 😳 Nick P8MRA - The green one with red wings. Which is now bent ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ Edited by - Nick Woods on 8 Oct 2002 17:37:15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted October 8, 2002 Share Posted October 8, 2002 the freestyle stuff seems to be to be the cheapest way of getting adjusable ARBs, damping and rideheight. to set up the car you need the rideheight adjustament. the other bits let you tune it to suit you, the track, tyres etc. The dampers also benefit from a 3:1 ratio of bump vs rebound damping rather than the 1:1 of the bilsteins. this is also a good thing as they need to be different as one way the spring is driving the car and the other way its driving the wheel which is lighter. (hmm.. that's a pants explanation, forget i said that....) but it is a good thing. The next step is the few hundred quid per damper route that nitron, leda etc can offer. I know this would be wasted on me. the adjustable damping and ARBs are not, it EASY to feel the difference even a small change makes. and its fun playing with it and great pub talk as well HOOPY Today I shall be mostly wanting to go for a blat R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennie Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Colin you may be confused over our products. Our handling kit consist's of dampers and ARB's. The dampers are adjustable for ride height and stiffness and come with rubber bushes or spherical joints and that was on the right hand side of my car at Brands Hatch. All the bit's are avalible separate and replace the standard bit's. The pushrod suspension, on the left hand side is untried and not proven. All the figures show it should give much better damper response from a faster damper action but I'm sure all the fiqures said the Titanic was unsinkable. I can't wait to get the car out on a track day and no doubt there will Blat chatters there to report back. Dave I'm sorry about the spherical joints they are not 'rose' which is a make of joint [a bit like hoover and vacuum cleaners] but are Aurora' and come with the dampers. Aurora are,in fact, the largest supplier in the world, according to there brochure, We raised the issue with AVO and from now on we do check all before they go out. We have had no complants from any others, dangerous to say on the net, so perhaps it's a one off. Glad your happy though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooby dooby doo Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Len - i thought that rose joint had become an accepted term now - the same way that Hoover is now in the dictionary 🤔 anyway - not sure if i can spell 'spericle' anyway HOOPY Today I shall be mostly wanting to go for a blat R706KGU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Len, Getting a little more specific about spherical joints, how important are they for road going cars and particularly on the bottom of the rear shocks on a live-axle car. Or is it adding complexity for little gain? Also, is there a price differential between bushed and spherical jointed suspension kits? Finally, what is the lead time for ordering a set for Gary to fit? Cheers, Graham Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennie Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 I'm not sure that given the conditions of our rads that you could tell any difference. they do mean that the spring works at it's true rate and not with the added effect of turning the bush.We think that our rubber bushes are fine but you know hoppy the pub is a great place to show off your bits. They are an extra £50 per set. you need to talk to Gary on 07801749054 about fitting or I will ask him this afternoon and get back to you You may well be right Dave about Rose joint but you never know who is reading these postings and I would hate to upset them nice people from 'Rose' Co. as they supply the bit's for the pushrod set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennie Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 For rad read roads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon wilson Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Through a combination of my own ignorance and poor advice I developed my VX car into a poor riding ill handling pig. Since fitting a Freestyle kit I have retrieved a brilliant combination of ride, handling and steering response. Particularly since I fitted the rear spring rates they reccommend (which I originally thought too soft). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strangely Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 Phil already posted a link to my web page where I comment on my experiences with the Freestyle dampers. I'm very happy. Not sure whether they're good enough to recommend as an upgrade to someone with a perfectly good set of Bilsteins, but I needed new dampers anyway. I also had the adjustable front anti-roll bar fitted, but didn't play with this until I went to an airfield track day last Friday. It behaves exactly as you'd want it to. Fully soft and the car was understeering a bit. With a twist of an allen key I wound it up to 4/6, and the understeer was gone. Excellent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewartG Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 That's funny, I thought the stiffer the front arb the more understeer. You weren't testing reverse gear at the same time were you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strangely Posted October 9, 2002 Share Posted October 9, 2002 >I thought the stiffer the front arb the more understeer That is generally true, although it wasn't in this case. I'm not quite sure why. Perhaps full soft let the car lean so much that one wheel was significantly unweighted; two tyres must grip more than one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Woods Posted October 10, 2002 Author Share Posted October 10, 2002 Thanks everyone for the replies so far - keep them coming !. If the cost differential between what my insurance will pay and the cost of the Freestyle kit isnt too great then I'll definitely be getting one. It does concern me a little that having too much to adjust means more chance of getting it wrong, but also makes it possible to get it right (regardless of whatever 'right' and 'wrong' mean in this context) Nick P8MRA - The green one with red wings. Which is now bent ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ 🙆🏻 ☹️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Stewart, There is more than one effect at play with the front ARB. If you just soften the front ARB the car will roll more. That roll will take away grip from the front because of camber changes. If you take away roll stiffness and add it at the back, then the car will roll the same amount, but be more prone to oversteer as you suggest. Generally speaking, no guarantees, it works for me, YMMV, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Hi Len You are very wise to be careful with the term "rose joint" as we got into trouble for using the term in our index as it is a registered trade mark to I think Dupont. The correct term is Rod end spherical bearing I'll call you when i'm coming done your way cheers dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now