sevenmad Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I notice that cc have released a 140bhp version of the sigma engine in the new supersport. Does anyone know more about the spec of the engine? Does it have uprated cams, throttle bodies, exhaust and how does it differ from the 150bhp (except by missing out on 10 bhp). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ. Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I've been wondering that, and also if they might do upgrades from the 125 in the future. I think it is like the 150 but with the single throttle body. Duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRL Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I think it has everything the 150 sigma does minus the throttle bodies i.e cams, valve springs, injectors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenmad Posted June 13, 2011 Author Share Posted June 13, 2011 That's what I presume too. To go from 125 to 150 you need: new cams with uprated springs quad throttle bodies and airfilter throttle potentiometer modine oil cooler and assoc pipework oil catch tank uprated injectors ecu remap manual cam belt tensioner (to cope with higher rev limit) Hence the £2600 for the upgrade! If an upgrade to 140 was part way then the upgrades might be staggered, as long as the parts were the same. I'm also interested as the cc throttle bodies and injectors are a major expense, and I've managed to get these in hardly used condition second hand! So I'm already half way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawmaw Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Steve and Steve were involved with the development of the Mountune fiesta. This has 140 BHP and i think is basically altered map, exhaust system and inlet piping which cost about £1500 from ford. My understanding is the internals of the engine remained unchanged but i may be wrong. A few years ago Jeremy Philips of Sylva fame took one of his Riots to Dave Walker for a ECU map that could then be sold on to customers who bought a standard Zetec Se 1600. This was a standard 100bhp engine but with a totally new exhaust system and a few less belts on the front of the engine. this produced 132 BHP so 140 from a tweaked VVT engine sounds entirely plausable. Another question is what on earth do you get for the extra charged for a 150 over a 120. Some pretty suboptimal throttle bodies using injectors in the original position and a mild cam uplift. In my view not worth it, buy a 120 and gradually upgrade starting with a programmable ECU and going from there idealy with my friends at Shawspeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRL Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I've read a few comments now on how an uprated exhaust will help release quite a few more ponies on the Sigma. What I find difficult to understand is where the restrictions are in the CC system. Other than a decat there really is not much there which could be causing a restriction to my eye. On a fiesta of course this could well be different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawmaw Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I agree, there is a difference in the characteristics of the engine depending on whether you have a 4,2,1 or a 4 into 1 as i found with mine but beyond that i am sure the Caterham system is fine but it will only work if accompanied by the appropriate map Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Morris Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Hi Guys, my Sigma(125) is being rebuilt, cams, new ecu,head work,steel rods & forged pistons, lightened flywheel! not sure what we will get, but hopeing for approx 200bhp, let you know when it comes off the dyno test, next 2/3 weeks, Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garth Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Look forward to see how you get on Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRL Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Hi Guys, my Sigma(125) is being rebuilt, cams, new ecu,head work,steel rods & forged pistons, lightened flywheel! not sure what we will get, but hopeing for approx 200bhp, let you know when it comes off the dyno test, next 2/3 weeks, Phil Nice one! Very interested to hear about the results so keep us posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawmaw Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Sounds good, who is doing your work? I presume you are on 42mm DTH TB's. I know of one engine on a lightened flywheel who'se flywheel let go big time, fortunately rear engined. I would THOROUGHLY recommend a steel flywheel! Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyCoulson Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Quoting sevenmad: I notice that cc have released a 140bhp version of the sigma engine in the new supersport. Does anyone know more about the spec of the engine? Does it have uprated cams, throttle bodies, exhaust and how does it differ from the 150bhp (except by missing out on 10 bhp). My sigma 150 (3k miles) was dynoed at 138.4 bhp by the 2 Steves so you may find the 140 version to be a bit less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richy Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 200 from a Sigma - looking forward to hear how this pans out.....who, where, how much 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mawmaw Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Richy, I have been racing a Sigma 1600 for 5 years. The difficulty I had was wet sump and no steel rods allowed in my old race series. Essentially my first engine on S n S RR produced 175 BHP with Head work, standard valves, weber 40's cams and pocketed pistons but due to the above it was not reliable, getting the power was easy keeping it less so. I regularly lunched rods and finally changed series (and in the process up'ed to 190+ BHP). I now run forged pistons, steel rods and a dry sump. I firmly believe this is the minimum needed (with a steel flywheel) to tune this engine seriously (ie 160bhp up). Since changing spec this engine produces an Easy 200 BHP, i currently produce 203 BHP, others with same spec 206. I am convinced another 10 BHP is easiliy there. My valve sizes, exhasut config and cams are not optimised because what i am trying to do at the moment is prove reliability. My current rev limit is 8650 on a Mike Jennings indexed Crank, despite this 210+ is do-able, much more than this needs a steel crank. Watch this space, next blow up I will let you know, none in the last 18 months, fingers crossed!!! Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richy Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Thanks for the info, Mark. Sounds like a significant upgrade to the standard 125 😬 richy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Morris Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Hi Guy's got my engine Dyno'd yesterday, 195bhp using the standard caterham cat./exhaust system. Let you know how she goes when its back on the road/track(2/3 weeks) ps Jeff Wilson of HWR Motorsport built the engine(He's good built my 300+bhp durtec engine's over the last 6 Years Mob: 07733137309 he built & race's(win's) the fastest Lotus Elise in the country.......not bad for an old timer! don't tell him that thou!, Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dignity Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Nice one Phil I have fitted those Dampers. Really pleased with them. Thanks once again. Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garth Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Sounds impressive Phil. Does the dyno give you a torque output? Did you go for the light flywheel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRL Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well done Phil, sounds very impressive and will hopefully help to put an end to this rubbish we keep hearing about the Sigma not being tunable. Please could could you give a little more detail on the spec? For example which cams, ecu and how extensive the head work was etc. Would also be interested in a ball park figure for cost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Morris Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Should have more info when i get dyno sheet, HWR built the engine, biggest pain/cost is the new ecu you will need! we went for omex 600, kent Race cams, Jeff Wilson fully ported head, kept same valve's thou for now! steel rods & forged pistons,modified wet sump. a lot of the water ways had to be modified from the standard engine caterham fit. dont know final cost's, put based on the money i've spent on "good" Duratec's in the past, this will be alot less(50%) you can still use your engine mounts, exhaust system, bellhousing, all helps to keep costs down,give Jeff a ring for more info spec's/costs, cheers Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garth Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Hi Phil - may be a silly question - but new to thinking about upgrades - what sort of reliability would you expect from the sort of upgrade you are doing? I have enjoyed my sigma 125 for a year now, and am confident that when I go to start it it will do just that! Some of the threads I have read about upgrades seem to be full of issues that need to be continually sorted out? What made you stick with the Sigma rather than upgrading to a Duratec? Cheers Garth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Morris Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Hi Garth, as quoted in my prev. comments I've had( a 2.0 on carbs, then T.Bodies, to full race 2.3 Cosworth 300+bhp!) Duratec engines over the last 7 Years! All race winning Cars & all reliable, only problem Costs just kept getting higher, so i retired from racing 18 months ago, but you get bored so bought a sigma engined caterham last year,nice car, just want more power, without paying big bucks! Jeff Wilson has Built all my Caterham engines over the last 15 years,even my old 1800 x/flow had 178bhp & did me proud; all the best, phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garth Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Hi Phil - just wondering how you are geting on with your upgrade - are you up and running yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Morris Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Yea,got car back Sat. in that mad rain storm(no screen) been out tonight only for Min. before rain came again! Feels good & wants to rev.(makes the car feel quick) but i can tell it lacks the torque of my old(300bhp!)Duratecjavascript:insertAtCursor(document.postpage.message, ' ☹️')saying that its about half the cost. need to do more miles with it, then i will report back, got a couple of races next month, then we can see how much slower it will bejavascript:insertAtCursor(document.postpage.message, ' *biggrin*')cheers, Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Golf Juliet Tango Posted August 9, 2011 Area Representative Share Posted August 9, 2011 As Mawmaw and Phil have said, the power can be made. There is no real issue there. How much do you want? They have used their engine builders (all credit to those chaps) and Rob Morley of Ratrace/Protune has done likewise (although the engine is in a Westie) getting well over 200BHP in an engine that powered the car to a season of WSCC Speed Series class wins. It is good that there are several good builders around to do this. That this is achievable at less cost than the equivalent Duratec (and obviously weighing considerably less) is very interesting. Obviously for Caterham, they have made a judgement on their sales steps and specs. This does not mean that these are the limiting points of the engines. Edited by - Golf Juliet Tango on 9 Aug 2011 11:46:02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now