MartinH Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 Hi All, My new (self built) Duratec R300 has done the following a couple of times. It only has 300 miles or so on the clock and I will be discussing with CC next week but any idea what this could be?... On my way to the meet point for the Penn Sevens blat yeseterday. I had done about 6 miles or so and the car was warmed up. Giving it some welly in 4th or so the engine misfires a couple of times. Few mins later doing a steady 50 in 5th or 6th the engine cuts out! ☹️ I prod the throttle and I get a whooshing sound coming from the exhaust (unburnt fuel and air maybe?) but the engine doesn't fire up again. Still coasting I try the starter button and the starter motor turns over but still the engine won't fire. I come to a complete stop and leave the car for two mins then start again and all is well. I then enjoy a two hour blat with no further misfires or any other problems. It is a bit of a worry though as I wouldn't want this to happen mid-overtake for example! Haven't done any investigation yet but I suppose could be an electrical fault. May be the immobiliser I guess? but the misfires a few minutes earlier would seem to indicate something else. Any clues? In particular, any suggestions for tests I could do to try and narrow it down? Cheers, Martin Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CageyH Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 Have you checked to see if your filler cap is vented? Thew wooshing could be from the fuel tank, as air rushes in. Only dead fish go with the flow....! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 27, 2010 Author Share Posted June 27, 2010 Filler cap vented? Well...whenever I go to fill with fuel I have a hell of a job getting the (aero) filler cap off due to the vacuum in the petrol tank. Eventually I prize it open enough to let some air in then I get a big blast of air going in. Is this normal? Could this vacuum be working against the fuel pump when trying to get petrol through to the engine?? Cheers, Martin Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mic Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 Check that the one way valve on the breather pipe is the correct way round. I think that may already be fitted before you get the kit. Edited by - mic on 27 Jun 2010 15:11:32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 27, 2010 Author Share Posted June 27, 2010 Breather pipe was fitted by CC. Is there an easy way to check? Does this mean that vacuum forming in the fuel tank is not good? M Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mic Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 Remove the filler neck cover, there are 3 hoses on the neck. Pull the smallest diameter one off and see if you can suck through it. If you can't and you can blow through it follow the hose and reverse the valve. A vacuum in the tank can cause fuel starvation and collapse the tank. Edited by - mic on 27 Jun 2010 16:03:33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 Hi Mic, You were right. Thanks again. Seems Caterham had installed this valve the wrong way around! Still, it was only a half hour job to untangle the pipes, reverse the valve and put back again. Hopefully that will stop the engine cut-out problems now. All seems to make sense if fuel couldnt get through anyway. Cheers, Martin Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil 01 Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 Hi Martin, You should also check that your tank hasn't been damaged by the vacuum it can implode and give false petrol gauge reading. Regards Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbird Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 probably notice if it had imploded 😬 might have distorted a bit, sorry pedant mode off, getting coat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 Oh dear ☹️ potential disaster! I put the car up on the stands to do the job on the breather valve and have just checked the tank (thanks for the tips guys). The front face of the tank is now decidedly CONCAVE! At the centre point I reckon it has distorted by about 5cms. I take that the tank normally has flat sides?? One for CC to sort out I reckon. I don't like the sound of a fuel tank that has been bent out of shape. Martin Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbird Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 would it be possible to pressurise it via breather, and ping it back out again ? don't know just a thought, is there a seem in the buckled area ? Edited by - tbird on 28 Jun 2010 20:18:29 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 29, 2010 Author Share Posted June 29, 2010 well, that's an interesting idea...any idea how to do that? Foot pump maybe? But how to connect to beather pipe? Might fatigue it more though? The indentation isn't in an area where there is a seam. I should probably take the ali boot floor out as well in case the top has gone in too I suppose. I am waiting for CC's advice now. M Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbird Posted June 29, 2010 Share Posted June 29, 2010 My slightly addled old brain was thinking along the lines of removing filter on breather and replacing with tyre valve, zip tie that on with small zip tie and use a foot pump or compressor, dont know if pipe would take pressure or even if aero cap would seal in that direction but if pipe accessible may be worth a go, my original thought was rubber bung fitted with valve in filler neck, but getting correct size bung would be a pita. Alternatively how do these dent master type people ping out similar dents in Panels, just trying to "think outside box" (or tank 😬) really maybe inspire other ideas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mav Posted June 29, 2010 Share Posted June 29, 2010 Much better idea is to speak to CC aftersales BEFORE you attempt any 'pressurisation of the tank to bend it back to shape' Aftersales are on 01322 625804 - James or Sharon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 29, 2010 Author Share Posted June 29, 2010 Indeed. I have already mailed them both. Quite busy now. Will call later today if no reply. Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 30, 2010 Author Share Posted June 30, 2010 CC are going to replace and refit the fuel tank. Fair play to them for sorting it out. Its a shame though that a simple mistake at the factory will now cost them hundreds to put right. Not the most convenient time of year to be without my car but I'll get over it. Better safe than sorry. Martin Duratec R300 SV finally alive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattie Posted June 30, 2010 Share Posted June 30, 2010 Phew, same issue, just checked. Checked with James at CC, yes it's wrong. Swapped over. Oddly even after two track days and 1600 miles, our tank hasn't deformed. Maybe the filler seal wasn't as good. So Martin, at least your misfortune has avoided ours. Much appreciated. Martyn R300GRR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderlane Posted June 30, 2010 Share Posted June 30, 2010 Martyn can you tell me how to identify if it's on the right way round or not? I'd like to check mine having read about you and MartinH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinH Posted June 30, 2010 Author Share Posted June 30, 2010 Hi Martyn, Glad you have avoided disaster - although sounds like you are having fun with your diff instead. Would be good to get a ride in each other's car at some point to compare notes. spiderlane - there is a version of how to do the check further back in this thread but I did it another way... I put the car up on the stands and got under to look at the breather pipe. I cut about 7 or so cable ties off and dropped the pipe out so that it was hanging down. The valve is a red metal piece about 2 inches long that has small jubilee clips holding the pipe on at either end. I opened the petrol tank filler cap to allow air in and blew into the breather pipe. I couldn't get air in. I removed the valve and put it back the other way around. Now I can blow air into the pipe - thus allowing the tank to suck air in when it needs it as fuel gets used up. I wonder how many other cars out there have this problem?! Hope that helps. Cheers, Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderlane Posted June 30, 2010 Share Posted June 30, 2010 Thanks Martin - gonna check that tonight. Like Rattie said, your misfortune might have helped me too. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbird Posted June 30, 2010 Share Posted June 30, 2010 ☹️ shame CC going to fix, I would love to have known if it could be pinged back out by pumping up pressure, Glad they are replacing it for you really 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderlane Posted June 30, 2010 Share Posted June 30, 2010 Mine seems to be the right way round - i.e. I can blow into it, but can't suck through it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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