SteveyC Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 Hi all, First post so be kind Been filling up the clutch master cylinder with fluid on my new build pre startup and i'm getting a fluid leak out of the lower bellhousing bolt. The clutch is different to the one in the manual as its an autobleed, according to caterham (dosen't have the bleed nipple). The clutch seem to work and there is pressure when you depress the pedal but something is wrong. Is it an engine out to fix and any ideas how to fix?? lost and confused half way to nowhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 hello & welcome I built my sigma kit 2yrs ago but it had the simpler manual bleed valve on the clutch which although fiddly to get at worked very well. To check if the clutch is at least working, if your able to lower the car onto the ground as a rolling chassis, put in say 2nd & see if the car can be moved by hand with the clutch right down. If you can't you have a problem. Mine wouldn't work at first but after a lot of head scratching it proved to be the centre plate stuck to the flywheel (cast iron/surface rust) I wasn't ready to run the engine at the time so cleared it by pushing it up & down the drive in 3rd gear with my daughter pushing the clutch. There was a "click" & away it went. If it's a leak from inside the bell housing you may have a problem with the slave cylinder which will mean engine out Have you fitted the clutch & throtle stops yet through the floor pan. Without the clutch stop fitted & adjusted it can be possible to damage the slave cylinder by forcing it to far. Good luck, keep us posted on how you are doing Edited by - Martin Jeffrey on 27 Sep 2009 16:30:03 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyC Posted September 28, 2009 Author Share Posted September 28, 2009 Cheers Martin, Had a go and seems like the clutch is working and i also noticed that the clutch pipe has a lock ring on it which was only finger tight, so tightened that as well and don't seem to have a leak any more 😳 all seems good now, now to try and crank it for the first time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Struggling with the Sigma clutch. Like most of the Sigmas its got the internal slave cylinder and the plastic bleed nipple which can be turned according to the build manual, clockwise & anti-clockwise, that's seems to work just fine, problem is I have no fluid moving through the system. I have pumped the peddle for a minute or so and nothings even coming out of the master cylinder. Any tips would be most appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stationary M25 Traveller Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Hi Steve Welcome to BlatChat. Glad it was an easy fix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richy Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Quoting evotell: Struggling with the Sigma clutch. Like most of the Sigmas its got the internal slave cylinder and the plastic bleed nipple which can be turned according to the build manual, clockwise & anti-clockwise, that's seems to work just fine, problem is I have no fluid moving through the system. I have pumped the peddle for a minute or so and nothings even coming out of the master cylinder. Any tips would be most appreciated. Can you try a Gunson's eezibleed on the master cylinder? (other bleeding tools are available 😬) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigCol Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Sorry if it's an obvious/patronising (you do know what patronising means, don't you? ) question... are you sure the bleed valve is *fully* open? That would explain the lack of fluid coming through. It's a bugger to get at and awkward to turn - bleeding difficult! (I too used an EeziBleed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Quoting BigCol: Sorry if it's an obvious/patronising (you do know what patronising means, don't you? ) question... are you sure the bleed valve is *fully* open? That would explain the lack of fluid coming through. It's a bugger to get at and awkward to turn - bleeding difficult! (I too used an EeziBleed) YES. 😳 I think the issue is that the clutch master cylinder which has no fluid coming out it requires bleeding 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Ok, Got some understanding why the clutch is lightly to be difficult to bleed. When you look at a brake calliper you will note that the bleed nipple is always at the top, because air rises to the surface. The internal slave cylinder on the Sigma has the bleed nipple below the cylinder, what were they thinking. Edited by - evotell on 11 Mar 2014 02:04:21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ. Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 As I understand it, the sigma clutch slave cylinder lies around the gearbox input shaft (concentric type). The bleeding nipple is at the top of the bell housing so well above that line. By the way, on my car if the bleed nipple is turned completely open, fluid runs straight through from master cylinder and out into a jar under the car. It makes for an easy fluid change, I just keep topping up the reservoir and wait Duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 What could be simpler than a bleed nipple, I don't know why it had to be changed to an auto bleed. Working as I do on heating systems & boilers the equivalent that is often fitted are auto air releases. Usually in brass & not unlike a carb float chamber. They always eventually leak at some point & as they are often fitted in roof spaces the first evidence of problems is a wet ceiling. sorry wondering off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Quoting DJ.: As I understand it, the sigma clutch slave cylinder lies around the gearbox input shaft (concentric type). The bleeding nipple is at the top of the bell housing so well above that line. By the way, on my car if the bleed nipple is turned completely open, fluid runs straight through from master cylinder and out into a jar under the car. It makes for an easy fluid change, I just keep topping up the reservoir and wait Duncan Although the slave cylinder is at the top of the bell housing as you correctly said, the bleed nipple is below the cylinder, which is why its a struggle to bleed. The bleed nipple should always be above the cylinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Paul Richards Posted March 11, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted March 11, 2014 Quoting evotell: The internal slave cylinder on the Sigma has the bleed nipple below the cylinder. I don't think so. As far as I am aware the slave cylinder is around the input shaft in the middle of the bellhousing and the bleed valve is at the top of the bell housing. Terry Make sure you have plenty of travel on the brake pedal. You really need to push the master cylinder in to get it to pump fluid. Edited by - Paul Richards on 11 Mar 2014 20:32:09 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Quoting Paul Richards: Quoting evotell: The internal slave cylinder on the Sigma has the bleed nipple below the cylinder. I don't think so. As far as I am aware the slave cylinder is around the input shaft in the middle of the bellhousing and the bleed valve is at the top of the bell housing. Terry Make sure you have plenty of travel on the brake pedal. You really need to push the master cylinder in to get it to pump fluid. Edited by - Paul Richards on 11 Mar 2014 20:32:09 The bradded inlet hose which come from the master cylinder is above the bleed nipple, how can that be correct when air rises? 😳 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Paul Richards Posted March 11, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted March 11, 2014 Terry It really doesn't matter where the bleed nipple is in relation to the master cylinder. What does matter is that the fluid can be pumped into the slave cylinder and the outlet is at the top of the slave cylinder so that there is nowhere for air pockets to hide. If you see what I mean. I think you'll find that the master cylinder on brakes is also higher than the bleed nipples and they work OK. Please just make sure the master cylinder pushrod is getting full travel and you'll find it will pump fluid through. 😬 Good Luck Edited by - Paul Richards on 11 Mar 2014 20:56:31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Job done 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Paul Richards Posted March 12, 2014 Area Representative Share Posted March 12, 2014 Good news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigCol Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Quoting evotell: Job done 😬Glad to hear it; what was the solution to Terry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evotell Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Quoting BigCol: Quoting evotell: Job done 😬Glad to hear it; what was the solution to Terry? I guess in the end it was just keep on bleeding it and then making some small adjustment on the linkage. As I have previously said the design is poor with the bleed nipple being below the slave cylinder inlet pipe, I am convinced that's were the air gets trapped. I spoke to a guy who works on modern Ford's here in Canada, and he told me that slave cylinder is used in many north American Fords and all of them are a bitch to bleed. Can is now finished, we deliver on Friday. Cheers Terry Edited by - evotell on 19 Mar 2014 14:17:24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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