Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Is anyone out there racing a duratec powered 7 and how does it compare to k series cars ? Mad Hatter Racing Coming To A Two Lane Black Top Near You Soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Comp Sec Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 No they don't. They are to heavy! Sorry Rob 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 Thought from a weight issue there was not much in it, and considering the extra torque worth looking at considering the figures on the Jackels forge website Or is my info wrong ? Mad Hatter Racing Coming To A Two Lane Black Top Near You Soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSL Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 There's more to it than just a drag race I guess its more likely to be super competitive on the sprints than the hillclimbs, but its relatively early days still for the Duratec cars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 I know it more than just a drag race But seems to me that the duratec is a much more robust and tuneable engine Will just have to lose weight else where 😬 Mad Hatter Racing Coming To A Two Lane Black Top Near You Soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Durrant Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Mad Hatter To date there is only one Duratec powered 7 in the championship and it will be interesting to see how it goes this season. To date the lighter and more nimble K series or Busa powered cars have proved to be more succesful in class 5 but time will tell. Mark D Comp Sec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Richard Price Posted March 3, 2009 Area Representative Share Posted March 3, 2009 Brodie Branch drove a Freestyle's Duratec demo car on a few rounds four or five years ago (was it 2005?). It was certainly competitive, but Brodie went back to using his own Busa car, but I don't recall why. Dave Jackson also did a couple of rounds with his Duratec conversion, but I'm sure he'd admit that, at that point, his Duratec was in a fairly low state of tune in comparison to his 1900 K. Having weighed a road spec Duratec R400, I don't recall it being significantly different in weight to a K series car. The plenum equiped Duratec R400's don't seem as eager to rev as a K R400, but, ultimatley only a back to back test would tell the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 I agree Richard, but a tuned duratec with throttle bodies mated direct to the block is a different matter 😬 I have a hayabusa myself and that does rev to hyperspace speeds 😬 I am trying to find a middle ground between busa powered screamer and a car that is happy blatting to Le Mans with like minded blatters 😬 Mad Hatter Racing Coming To A Two Lane Black Top Near You Soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSL Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Richard, Brodie went back to his Busa mainly for the following reasons- It was faster than the Duratec / He hated the shocking sequential gearbox & lastly it was much more fun to drive If you already have a Busa engined 7 you have the car of choice for the hillclimb part of the club championship at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 Oh no thanks Mine is the real deal with two wheels Just needs a turbo 😬 Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 If i wanted a busa powered race car i would probably go for a pilbeam or force This car needs to be for dual use, not just racing And the racing is just for fun at the moment Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force Edited by - Mad Hatter on 3 Mar 2009 21:47:13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSL Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I can fully recommend a Force too 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 Yes but like i said i am not in the market for a pure race car at the mo Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 So are there any Duratec owners out there with an opinion ? An owner who has switched from a K series to duratec Be good to hear from you 😬 Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Williams Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I can see no reason why a Duratec car wouldn't perform well it's just that there haven't been too many of them involved in our championship as yet. Adrian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 It will de interesting when a few start mixing it with the k's Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSL Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 It would be good to see a new R500 competing for sure, get the cheque book out Madhatter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Plato Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 😬 Having experienced both and with reference to an earlier thread whilst keeping a genuinely unbiased view on the 2 engines and just straight feedback... here and with a further year or 2 of experience of the Duratec. There was only 6/8 Kg weight difference for the complete installation on my conversion using a modest 226bhp. This was with a wet sump fitted. With a dry sump and that terrible positioned tank over he front crucifix then I would expect the weight gain over and above my previous K series to be in the order of 18kg/24 +. Then this would start making a difference to the handling and turn in of the front end. The other difference on my particular engine spec is that with 226bhp being generated at a lowish 7400rpm max revs / rev limiter the top end power is lacking on long courses and tends to make the car the same straight line speed as a R400 K with 210 bhp. This was seen at Combe where I would be side by side with a R400 race car down the straights but I was able to corner at the same speed on the same tyres ( and 7/10ths quicker over the lap). Turn in is slightly less sharp than the K, but very very marginally, but remember I have the "lightweight" installation with no dry sump... I imagine a 2.3 with a wet sump and a large oil tank over the crucifix would have similar turn in to a VX engine car The torque of the engine is mush more linear than the K and hence you can apply power earlier out of a low speed corner without the engine coming on cam at 5500 rpm and upsetting the chassis / grip. At curborough power doesn't have much to do with times - if you recall I went just 1 whole second slower at 57 sec with the little 1600 K @ 140 bhp. Its my intention to up the power of my next Duratec engine and then I think the package will be more comparable to my last 1900K @ 247bhp. It will be interesting to try this engine down the strip at fastest Caterham in the world event to see how the straightline compares to my previous K. The beauty of the Duratec is that it doesnt have that fragile feeling to it and you have to love the torque, but my particular engine could do with another 100bhp 😬 The r500 has the drysump and tank over crucifix I believe so it would be interesting to try one. here is C7 TOP Taffia joint AO with Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgrigsby Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I guess I should comment as the only Duratec powered car in the championship in recent years, I've driven a lot of other Caterham's with a range of engines and yes the Duratec is different. Mines a 2.3 which makes it a very relaxed car to drive with a smooth power delivery that I think works very well. This year will be interesting as I've been to a lot of the circuits/sprints so hopefully will be more competative. Overall I think once you get the car set-up well the Duratec engine does give a nice balance but it's very different to an R500 for instance. Keep an eye out this year and see how things turn out, my first event will be Goodwood which in theory is a bit of a power circuit so may suit my car more than certain other venues. Cheers Rob G www.SpeedySeven.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Plato Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 How do you consider the Duratec different then Rob ?. When I drove a 2.3 280bhp duratec I was disapointed by the linear power delivery which gave the impression that the engine was a long stroke and didnt realy have a distinctive power band (it was quick everywhere ) and throttle response was less then my 2L and considerably less then say a 1600K series. I drove the dry sumped 2.3 on the road so I didnt get near to its cornering limits to determine any effect of engine weight on handling. I imagine the advantage would be gained at Goodwood, Aintree, Pembrey and Angleseeeee ? here is C7 TOP Taffia joint AO with Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgrigsby Posted March 5, 2009 Share Posted March 5, 2009 Pretty much exactly that Dave, when I first drove my 2.3l Duratec I was actually disappointed. It just didn't feel that quick, I'd changed from a revvy steel crossflow with a very clear power band to an engine that as you say feels fairly flat. However when you look at the speedo you realise that it's just quick everywhere. On the handling front I think the extra weight does make a little difference but it's more the power delivery that changes the way you drive the car, with an R500 it felt like you could ring it's neck more of the time but with a Duratec that doesn't always work which I guess is due to the extra torque that means you have to be that little bit more careful. However since fitting Gary's pushrod system on my car I think I may have found a better balance so it'll be interesting to see how it goes this year. Inevitably I'll have an advatage at the longer circuits but with any luck it'll work well in the tighter stuff this time as well. Previously I just struggled with getting a decent setup. Oh one final thing, throttle response is interesting. Mine was OK but since changing to the different exhaust it was a bit strange, however I popped up to Emerald ad Dave has worked some magic which signifcantly improved it at the expense of it making a few more pops and bangs than before. Cheers Rob G www.SpeedySeven.com Edited by - rgrigsby on 5 Mar 2009 19:33:25 Edited by - rgrigsby on 5 Mar 2009 19:43:40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 5, 2009 Author Share Posted March 5, 2009 Hi Rob Can you explain the push rod system please Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Lynch Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Freestyle Pushrod System EN Yorks 7's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgrigsby Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 That's the one, it's made a significant difference to the feel of the car, the steering is lighter and level of front end grip seems to be improved with no loss of grip at the rear. It also seems to cope with bumps a lot better without the car being deflected. But until I get on track who knows if it's actually any quicker. 😳 Cheers Rob G www.SpeedySeven.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racing Snake Posted March 8, 2009 Author Share Posted March 8, 2009 Well thats it then i have joined the duratec owners Have to say as my first seven and as a long time superbike rider this little rocket has blown me away. Which i didnt expect as i also currently ride a Suzuki Hayabusa but after the 100 mile trip home yesterday with my new toy i was left just wanting more and shaking 😬 No other vehicle has ever had that effect on me before, why did i wait so long sitting on the fence ? doh Cant wait to get the screen off and get it round a track or two and up a few hills A big thank you to all you fellow owners who have given me advice on the forum I look forward to meeting you out and about blatting 😬 K series or duratec it does not matter these little cars are fabulous end of story Mad Hatter Racing - Feel The Force 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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