IKB Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Following the thread on the performance of the CDX on Fifth Gear should I change the OE Avons on my 51 VX live axle car to AO21s? I realise that it will change the roadholding characteristics and wet weather handling (not that this bothers me as I am a fair weather freak!) but do the benefits take away something special about these cars? Opinions please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markiebabes Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 John I would definitely change from the Cr322's as the A021's are a great tyre You will notice a change in grip(wet and dry)and better handling characteristics, braking will also feel more inspiring ❗ after changing my old car (live axle crossflow )from Avon's the difference was incredible 😳. ask John (Bio) for his opinion next time he's at Penn he changed and is very pleased with the results . 😬 Mark 7 Webshots here R400 😬 pure fun ( more so with Aero fitted ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadsport06 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 My plumber has CR322 on his van, enough said about their grip. BRG and Yellow nose now with added brooklands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarchHare2008 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Caterham put CR322's on the CDX for the same reason they put them on the Academy cars. They have very limited grip but they last for ever. Both characteristics are great for learning the behavior of a car round a track (or car park if you want to perfect donuts!). They are reasonably progressive and, in combination with the LSD on the CDX, will let you get the back out quite easily. Generally considered a comedy tyre rther than a serious track or even road tyre I'd say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7 Sevens Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Personally I enjoyed my Cr322's as they offered little grip and the car would gently slide. End of the day its purely down to how much or how little grip you are happy with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claire Voyant Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 21s good all round (lets hope they are round ) choice on the road. good in the wet, others will be better in the dry but I have never run out of grip in the dry on the road (not trying hard enough) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Smith Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Generally considered a comedy tyre rther than a serious track or even road tyre I'd say. I've passed plenty of Caterhams on "serious" track tyres whilst running CR322s and their ilk... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKB Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 *arrowup*Graeme.......I think that says a lot about the driver than the tyres in this instance But seriously do you have a view or is your experience limited to the Regulations? PS Probably a silly question as you must get all the Seven thrills you need on the track and leave the sideways chat to us dudes who post on here Edited by - brunel on 11 Feb 2009 13:33:00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Smith Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I'd say that CR322s and their ilk (Yoko A539s, etc) are actually very good track tyres - they do have very limited grip, but this makes you think about how to drive the car well (in open series, drivers often say they need more power/grip, but actually they just need to make the most of the power/grip they've got). I like to think of it as like a 1950s GP car with a bit more power than grip Having said that, on the road - on a Seven - they can be quite limiting and a bit to much throttle/steering/brake can see you heading towards a hedge or worse. Yoko 021Rs have more grip (but not too much...) and are probably a much better day-to-day tyre. If I used my Caterham mostly on the road, I'd probably run it on 21Rs... And do bear in mind that 70-profile 21s are much cheaper than 60-profile in 13-inch (£35 vs. £65??). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMarc Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Brunel, I made the switch from 322's to 21's a year ago. The 322's were fine but not very confidence-inspiring when you leant on them. It was not that they lost 'bite' early (which they did but that in itself is not a problem) but I was never confident that they would bite again in enough time. I can lean much harder on the 21's: the hold on longer and in my opinion, the slip is far more predictable. Having said that, I can see why 322's would be great track tyres; in fact for the talented driver they are probably more fun (fun, not quick) than 21's 😬. For all this though, I don't plan on switching from 21's. Regards Marc Yellow flares and a X-flow - who said the 70's are over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKB Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 Thanks guys for the good advice *thumbup*Sounds like this is my Springtime upgrade........look out for my sale ad "4 partly worn and 1 unused CR322s" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezky Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 John Well worth putting 021's on, ring George Polley motorsport for best prices (no one else comes close). Nice blat over there if you want him to fit them. Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bio Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Hi Changed from ZV1 to AO 21 last year and the differance is staggering. Now covered 7000 miles including a european trip in my VX and have 1-2000 miles left on the rears (Fronts ok) General road performance very good even in the wet JOHN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon_hill Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 How the hell do you get yours to last so long John 🤔 My back ones seem to need replacing about every 4k! Fronts probably do about 7k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Day Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Simon - 4k I must be doing something SOooooooooo wrong then if I last a season of the spring/summer I am doing well Events, Media, Video, Automotive Training Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I had a set of 21R when I first got my car a few years ago. I got through the rear pair in a couple of months! Thats what has put me off using them again. However, Im considering given them another go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokko Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 I switched to Yoko 539’s from 5 year old 322’s (as fitted to the car from new) after an off at Curborough - really happy with the 539’s apart from sump clearance reduction in going from 70 profile down to 60. I shied away from A021’s because of the mileage I cover (5k pa over the last couple of years, but will probably be nearer 7k this year). I didn’t want to be getting through a set of tyres in less than a year Steve - Orange and Black ex Academy - now looking at things from a slightly different perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Chan Posted February 14, 2009 Area Representative Share Posted February 14, 2009 I have had A021r's a few times and they last 6k miles on average. It helps being rotated round the car thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Whitley Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Blokko, if you're doing that mileage then I presume a fair bit is in the wet in which case isn't the extra cost of A021s justified? I haven't tried 539s, the only "ordinary" tyres I've tried were Pilots I do go through a set of tyres (or more) a year. (FWIW Toyo 888s don't give me as much confidence in the wet as A021s and don't seem to last as long.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokko Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 TBH Tony, I don’t know whether it is the fact that I have a relatively lowly powered car, or that I drive like a girl (especially in the wet), but on the occasions I’ve found myself out in the rain in the 7 I’ve always felt that the 539’s give me plenty enough grip. -----Steve - Orange and Black ex Academy - now looking at things from a slightly different perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Until you have to break hard in the wet, then youll hate the A539s!! I had two sets - in the dry they were fine, but in the damp and wet, I had zero confidence in them. I then got a set on used CR500 to try & they were fantastic. Unfortunately these need replacing, hence my interest in this thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irrotational Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 My 21s also only seem to last a year - maybe 4k-5k... as per earlier threads i have had real trouble with the middles wearing quicker than outers i.e. pressure too high - and thats already with them down at 15 psi!! Im going o have to get another set soon! Also note Graemes point about cost - the 60 profiles are double the price of the 70's!! I am switching to 7s at the mo.... --- my mind is blank.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadsport06 Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Blokko, I'd try some hard braking in the wet on an airfield or something, I had a few moments on ZV3. Finding that the grip wasn't there. A bit scary when trying to get on to the autobahn. I felt that A048 were an improvement in the wet and they are a dry tyre, at the cost of A021 then I'd want those. I thought I was pushing mine until I went out with DSL in a k series R400, then realised I wasn't . Since then, I began to drive much harder, even with ZV3 but then found out in the wet in Germany that the hard tyres offer no grip in the wet. BRG and Yellow nose now with added brooklands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Plato Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 as mentioned above ..... I nearly killed myself trying to do an emergency stop with rock hard "road" type tyres on a Caterham. There is simply no grip to stop. sliding around on low grip tyres is one thing but remember that you also have to try and stop every once in a while 😬 and before some smart 🙆🏻 says "ooohhh you should only travel as quick as you can see the road ahead etc etc etc " well a lorry simply changing lanes right in front of you on a dual carridgeway is not realy to be expected ..... here is C7 TOP Taffia joint AO with Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokko Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 My only emergency stop to date (since I changed from 322’s to 539’s) has been in the dry on last years Monster Blat - mighty impressed how quickly the car stopped (I think if anything has been behind they would have smashed into the back of us). Point taken though re stopping distances in the wet. Friends Phil & Moira have an identical car to mine running A021’s. If we happen to be in the same location this year in the wet, maybe we can have a go at comparing stopping distances I would have thought that stopping distances would be shorter than tin tops given the lower mass of the 7? Or does the being lighter work against us in the wet - aquaplaning? Steve - Orange and Black ex Academy - now looking at things from a slightly different perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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