a7bca Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Hello All Having been on Roadhog last weekend , it seems my 1700 supersprint is lacking a bit of grunt..... I know it wont ever keep up with lots of the newer cars, superlights etc. I just wondered what other owners had done to theirs to get a little bit more out of it. I am not looking to replace the engine so i appreciate there is limited upside. Equally I am not really looking to spend thousands either... Not being particularly clued up on engines I wondered what i can do. I plan to take the spare wheel off to reduce weight and replace with some tyre weld. Cheers James ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgrigsby Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Hmm dificult to know what to suggest on a standard supersprint, there are lots of routes but if you're getting someone else to do the work it's not going to be cheap. TBH a lot of people have just gone the Zetec conversion route, if you get the bits 2nd hand it's not to expensive. Having said that my 244cam Roger King 1700cc Xflow was fantastic but it also wasn't cheap. Cheers Rob G www.SpeedySeven.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan c Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 James Loosing weight from the car is definately one area, others might be more controversial and comment on clams v cycle wings. So swop metal for CF, go for lighter radiator, smaller battery etc etc. If you want ideas as to what is out there get hold of Burtons catalogue and have a look at the Vulcan engineering web site. Also talk to Nigel at the next Penn meeting he has been through most of the options and a few diff's on his live axle car! Is yours LA or De Dion? Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcNS Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I think some Toyo 888's and electronic ignition upgrade will be the best routes. It took 2 years to get mine sorted. I can keep up on the blats but when running with CSR's I tend to be thrashing it when they are just short shifting however round the corners I am on a par . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 hi thanks for the replies. Alan, mine is de-dion. I will try and grab him then next time (you might have to point him out to me.... 😳) I will have a look at the vulcan site too. What is burtons catalogue, i have never heard of that? couple of questions. 1. how does an electronic ignition upgrade help, is that weight saving? 2. toyo 888 are track tyres i think? Would they be any use as everyday tyres. I wont be tracking the car with any seriousness, other that for fun, so most use will be road use. if they are are there good middle ground tyres part road/ part track. 3. I assume a zetec conversion is a full engine swap ? thanks james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 According to many, the best upgrade is a 3D mapped ignition. It won't give much more power, but the torque comes in earlier making the car more drivable and quicker through the mid-range. If that is too much, get an Aldon mapped dizzy with their electonic ignition and you will have much the same effect but without the potential fuel saving of 3D. Beyond that, you start looking at forged pistons, 244 cam, ported head, 4-to-1 exhaust manifold and the money starts to add up. If you want to start removing weight, start with the driver! Also look at removing the heater and windscreen. Tyre wise, look at Yokohama A021Rs. Good general road tyre for cars with 130'ish bhp. For better speed on the road, possibly look at driving tuition so that you can maintain the greatest amount of speed through corners while staying safe. This is probably your best bet at keeping up with younger cars. Burton catalog Vulcan crossflow engines and parts Cheers, Graham ------ Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Edited by - Graham Sewell on 17 Sep 2008 14:34:12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 Hi I can confirm the driver is on a weight loss program ... ahem.... I will have a look into the 3d mapped ignition you mentioned. is that weber alpha 3d ignition, i have seen that referenced. I have also seen megajolt ignitions talked about, are they any good? I am afraid some of the talk is a bit beyond my limited technical knowledge but gives me something to ask about. Thanks James ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 i think part of my problem is that i dont know fully what the engine has got at the moment. Even though it was sold to me as a 1700 the chassis plate says 1600, but i gather this is possible/not uncommon if it was upgraded later on. the only way to tell for sure is to dig into the engine i think? equally it has twin weber dcoe 45 carbs on it, again so i was told when i bought it, so not the 40's. more than that i dont really know, so i guess i need to get some expert eyes on it to investigate! james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Externally there is no way of knowing for sure whether an engine is 1600 or 1700 as they all come from the same block. Once you take the head off - not necessarily a trivial task - the size of the bores will soon indicate whether the 1600 has been bored out to 1700 or even 1800! DOCE45's are normally OTT for a 1700 supersprint - although I am sure that they can be jetted correctly if care is taken, but if the choke sizes are too large you will sacrifice mid-range drivability for top end power. This is not useful on the road as the amount of time spent about 5000rpm is not normally that great. As you say, the first thing is to determine what you have bought and then progress. I presume that the previous owner did not pass on any receipts with the car that may help. Unfortunately, I do not know how you can check the type of camshaft and that is probably the second most crucial detail after the capacity of the engine. Once you have both of these, get the advance mechanism calibrated by Aldon, and the car will probably fly. Good luck. Cheers, Graham ------ Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DW Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Hi James As a 1700Xlfow owner I think it would be worth checking what you've got is in good order. I've got Webber 45s too on mine, along with an Aldon Distributor/Ignitor. It's great on the road and should give you enough power for road use. Go to a rolling road and get them to check (1) The compression on the cylinders (confirms the piston rings are in good nick) (2) The timing (if it's not right you won't be getting max power) (3) The set up of the carbs and the overall power (ditto) Perhaps someone else can suggest somewhere local to you. Regards David 1700XF: click here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 hi i did get plenty of receipts but none that tell me the cc for example. i think an investigation session is required, then the rolling road tests. i will have to make some calls. Thanks for the answers everyone. cheers - james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JampJ Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I think you need to trace the history of the car, as already mentioned 45s are not correct for a 1700 it should be 40s, so the engine may have been already modded. The DVLA will send you a full history of the car for a fiver(last time I checked), which will give all details of the previous owners and should, if people have been honest any mods to the car. Plus it's a good selling point to know exactly what you've got. Did you buy it from a garage or private? Are you sure they are 45s? The 40s should hace DCOE 151 on the top cover, and DCOE 152 for 45s. Cheers John JFDI (Just F*****g Do It) Edited by - johnjulie on 18 Sep 2008 08:53:58 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 i would need to check the carbs to be sure, i will look for those numbers and check. i think caterham can provide a car history too, might check with them too Cheers james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JampJ Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Not sure about Caterham having the history. Doubt very much if they know mine's now in Brisbane Australia. They do keep a record of the first owners. DVLA isthe way to go. The last owner will be on the V5 as a start Cheers John JFDI (Just F*****g Do It) Edited by - johnjulie on 18 Sep 2008 09:16:33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LesG Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Hi James, Further to your request re. Supersprint upgrades, I'd recommend you give Steve Parker a ring (he advertises in LF). He's been very helpful to me, and seems always keen to chat, not necessarily to just sell you something (unlike some companies that may share the same name as a high-street men's clothes retailer). I'd also be keen to learn more about the 3D ignition systems for my own car's future development, any advice from other blatchatters? Cheers, Les. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Thanks, i will have a look in LF for him. I have emailed caterham to see in any case, someone mentioned it at roadhog at the weekend so we shall see. James ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Wong1697456877 Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Some useful info here. ----- VDU 7X Pics More VDU 7X Pics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Kingsley Young Posted September 18, 2008 Area Representative Share Posted September 18, 2008 Steve Parker has just rebuilt my 1700 engine drives realy well now and I am still running it in. Worth giving him a ring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcNS Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 What is Steve parkers prices? I'm saving up as I need to pull the 4 speed gearbox out soon so might as well start some more mods. Marc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Golf Juliet Tango Posted September 19, 2008 Area Representative Share Posted September 19, 2008 James When at Penn also talk to Oliver who has done work on his Crossflow. His key items were forged (rather than cast) pistons and 3D ignition as mentioned elsewhere Nigel Hopkins (like me) uses Ratrace for a lot of work. Oliver does this sort of thing for himself. I will be getting Rob to refresh and upgrade the 90,000+ mile Crossflow in GJT next year. Democratic dissent is not disloyalty, it is a positive civic duty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 thanks for all the replies, i definately have some research and calls to make. think i had better sort out the crazy amount of oil it seems to be drinking 1st, almost a litre per 4-500 miles. that does not seem right to me????? oh and re the carb sizes, i stand corrected they are 40's, not 45's as i said. james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstark Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 James - do you have an oil catch tank? Most of the oil that went from my x-flow ended up going out via the breather at high revs. 7-Indulgence re-routed it back via one end of the rocker cover and then from the other end into a catch tank and it hardly uses any oil now. Mine is also a Steve Parker engine and, touch wood, it's been great for the past 7 years including plenty of sprints and a few track days. We kept up with several 200+bhp cars at the recent Brands GP day (OK, not in a straight line but certainly over a lap ) and while I wouldn't claim it to be fast in Seven terms it certainly ain't a slow car. I enjoy it anyway 😬 Bob Stark Supersprinter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 20, 2008 Author Share Posted September 20, 2008 hi i am not sure re the catch tank to be honest. i really need to get it checked out though as today i reckon it has used 1litre of oil in 180 miles.... i am told that likely it has done far more miles than the clock says and oil is getting into the fuel somehow and burning off when the petrol ignites as the pistons go up and down.... so maybe the engine needs a bit of a rebuild... need to find that out.... would you believe the mileage of 24k, on a 18yr old car with 8 owners? naively, i did, the old man reckons the mileage has probably been altered. hmmm james ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstark Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 The mileage could well be genuine - mine is 18 years old, 2 owners, 29K - but most of that is way harder than you'd drive a repmobile. The Steve Parker engine was fitted at 18K as an upgrade to the original 1600cc unit. If you're burning that much oil I'd expect to see plenty of blue smoke from the exhaust under power, especially at high revs - get a mate to follow you and check. (most likely candidate would be oil getting past the piston rings and burning off if that's the case) Personally, I'd book the car into one of the many specialists and get them to give it a good checking over - I can personally recommend Redline in Caterham and 7-Indulgence in Meopham, Kent. I understand that Caterham didn't use the best pistons when the cars were new (do a search on here) Bob Stark Supersprinter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a7bca Posted September 20, 2008 Author Share Posted September 20, 2008 hi yes i will book it in prob with james whiting who i have used before. athough will chat to some of the many recommendations i have had - thanks guys. is hard to know re the mileage, now i think about it perhaps the 8 owners should have been a warning sign, i dont know. anyhow is too late now. i dont mind too much as i love the car whatever really! so if it needs a bit of love and attention and oh yes a couple of grand... then so be it! james i have noticed white smoke under hard acceleration, never coloured though. ----------------------------------------------------- Caterham Red 1991 De-Dion 1700 X/FLOW my car habit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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