which gearbox for fast 7 ???

[Marius]

I´m just about to get my 230BHP Vauxhall-lump fitted and am now thinking about a proper gearbox. I´ve got still the factory Type 9 box fitted together with the 3,92 LSD.

I know there are a lot of boxes around but you also hear different stuff about how good/bad they are. Currently I´m thinking about one of these options:

 

TYPE 9 STRAIGHT-CUT by Caterham: I know it does whine but hey, that´s what we want, and I love it´s tall 1st.

 

CATERHAM 6speed: it´s expensive and I wonder if the ratios are not too short. 1:1 in 6th gear is probably not ideal for circuit racing in a Vauxhall-powered car as it does not rev as high as a modified K-Series

 

5speed SEMI-HELICAL by SPC: I´m really tempted by this one: tall 1st gear, 1:1 in 4th, seems ideal

 

QUAIFE sequential box: it´s bloody expensive but maybe worth it ? Anyone experienced with this box ?

 

I´m very thankfull for any suggestion about this topic concerning reliability, slickness of gearshift, recommendations etc.

As already said I don´t mind noise, I´m just interested in a 7 that goes like stink.

[Matt Prior]

Marius,

 

I've got a Quaife 5-speed straight cut box in my Vauxhall HPC (220ish bhp).

 

It was already fitted when I bought the car two months ago, so I can't say how it compares to those other boxes; but I can tell you that it's bloody noisy. It works rather well, but is a bit of a strain on the ears over longer distances.

 

Matt

 

 

[Chairman Roger]

I have a type 9 Sierra box with Quaiffe close ratio heavy duty internals. As far as I can see the "heavy duty" refers to the fact that there are needle roller bearings used internally instead of just plain shafts. I have also heard this box referred to as a needle roller box. It is noisy (but I like the noise also) and it is not so bad that I get complaints from passengers (read wife) on touring trips.

 

As with all versions of this type of box the weak point is the bronze synchro rings used by Ford. Third gear is a favourite to break and when it does the effects can vary from a crunchier shift to stuck in gear and unusable How quickly these break is a function of how quickly you try to change gear and in my case they didn't last very long (difficult to be exact but 4/5 track days). They lasted much better when my driving was just confined to public roads. There is a fix. Fit moly coated steel synchro rings from SPC. These can still crack but nowhere near as often and when they do go it is unusual for the box to become unusable. Quaiffe do a version of the steel ring also but I do not believe that it is moly coated and so needs regular stripdowns of the box to re lap the ring in order to prevent it friction welding itself to the synchro cone. The down side is that the change becomes quite a bit crunchier with steel rings but not too bad if you get the revs right.

 

Another thing to watch out for especially with higher power cars is cracked outer casings. I try very hard to have a leak free car and was mystified for a number of months by what I thought was a heavily breathing gearbox or a continually wearing rear propshaft seal. I mentioned this to Steve Perks at SPC and he very quickly located the hairline fracture in the vicinity of the level plug. he rebuilt the box using a second hand casing which cracked again in the same place after about 1000 miles. To date I have no solution to this problem which apparently affects the Caterham Vauxhall installation more than other Seven types, except for maybe trying an alloy case which although softer may be less brittle or a brand new (read expensive) Ford casing.

 

The higher 1st gear (2.04) is a bit difficult at first but soon becomes second nature. Fitting close ratios was probably the single biggest improvement to my car.

 

Edited by - Chairman Roger on 15 Aug 2000 16:22:49

[StewartG]

One of the options mentioned in the original question was the Quaife sequential shift box has no-one been a guinea pig for us and tried this?

[Alex Wong1697456877]

If you don't mind noise, I'd go for a straight cut box. I was lucky enough to drive Roger's car for 350 miles from Paris to B'ham and yes the box is very noisy but it was far from unbearable. Very in keeping with his car which is a pretty extreme beast. At Curborough, I didn't even notice the noise. The steel synchro's are crunchy but rewarding if you're firm with it and match revs on downshifts. You do have to readjust your mechanical sympathy a bit to make it work.

 

I've often refered to my car as a junior version of his. Less power, smaller tyres and it has a windscreen! My car has the SPC semi-helical box. First is not as high as Roger's but the other ratio's are the same. The semi-helical is much quieter and with the bronze rings, has a much easier shift (especially with the Quaiffe quickshift lever). It still whines more than the standard type 9 but is hardly noticeable compared to the straight cut. It actually makes just the right sound to make the car sound more race car like (silly I know) without ever being intrusive.

 

I'd agree with Roger in so much as it's the best upgrade I've bought. I've done three and a half track days with the car since the new box went in, and a sprint at curborough and so far, it's been fine. Still, everything I've broken on my car has failed on Roger's before! I'm still waiting for the gearbox casing to crack, or my first broken synchro.......

 

Of these two boxes, if the car is mainly a road car, I'd go for the semi-helical with bronze rings. If track driving is your priority, I'd go for the straight cut box with the steel rings.

 

Just my humble opinion though!

 

 

Alex Wong

alex.wong@lotus7club.co.uk

www.alexwong.net

Home : 44-(0)121-440 6972

Fax : 44-(0)121-440 4601

 

Edited by - Alex Wong on 16 Aug 2000 02:49:21

[Marius]

Thanks for your suggestions so far, the 5speed straigh-cut by Quaiffe seems for me the one to go for, complete with moly coated steel rings and the needle-bearings.

As far as I know Steve from SPC deals with all kind of Quaife-goodies, do you think he could supply me with a complete box or do I have to buy it at Quaife and give it afterwards to SPC ? Would be f... ´cause it´s quite a few miles away from Germany. I think I´ll just give Steve a call. Thanks again for your help, I really appreciate it. An further experiences still welcome....

[Slipper man]

Upgrading to Quaife internals (by the way, the best upgrade I have ever made to a car - completely transformed it) used to be relatively cheap. I assume that it still is. They only charge about GBP80 for labour, and the internals for my last one were about GBP750. You just send the box to them, and they send it back, working beautifully.

 

The best way to go, unless you can afford big money for a 6 speed.

[elie boone]

Marius,

I have shoehornd a Borg Warner gearbox in my live axle chassis because i heard all those rumers about breaking the j5 Ford box.This is a verry strong gearbox i now because i did rally service on a group n car with at least 300bhp+ and whe never had a problem.The only drawback is that it is VERRY CLOSE with in the sides of the tunnel, if and how it works i let you now next year when my car is finished,or if anybody out there have done this convertion please let my now.(the Borg Warner has double syncro on 1st and 2nd gear).

 

 

[Marius]

I had a closer look into the Quaife-catalog and found some interesting items. So ideal gearbox would be

 

5gears, straight-cut, 2.04 in 1st, 4th 1:1, coated syncros, alloy-top-cover, maybe alloy casing, that would be an extra 400 BPS. A box like this will be around a 1000 BPS + VAT. Still much cheaper than the 6speed...

I heard about the Borg & Warner gearboxes but I think they´re also heavier than the Type 9 one (maybe that´s why they don´t break: constructed for tank-use).

Thanks for all the advises, I´ll give Steve a call and let him do that box for me, worth a try I think.

[Nick]

Alex, I think my balk ring's on the way out on my standard 5 speed box in a 1998 1.6K ss as there's a cruch when changing at high revs from 2nd to 3rd. I'm hoping that the gearbox has some life left in it yet but if it dies, the SPC jobby you have sounds interesting.

 

Noises aside, how is it better than the standard box? I do find at some circuits, eg a couple of complexes at Anglesey and Gooseneck at Cadwell, that the standard box isn't quite right, with 2nd being too high whilst 3rd is slightly too low - I'm obviously not going fast enough! I assume that the closer ratios of the SPC box would improve that sort of situation?

 

Does it rev out in 5th? When do you use 5th? How does pulling away from rest compare with the standard box?

 

I realise you have the Vauxhall engine so can't really make a direct comparison but I'd be interested in your comments - along with those of anyone who has made the change in a 1.6K ss.

 

Many thanks

Nick

[Alex Wong1697456877]

In my car, the SPC box's ratio's are pretty much perfect. Obviously the ratio's are not nearly as close as those you'd find in a six-speed which really suits the K series SS engines. In my car, it will pull to 7000rpm in 5th which gives an indicated 140mph (probably more like 130 in reality). It does come into use on tracks with long straights but allows comfortable cruising at 80mph on the motorway. 1st is quite high but still spins wheels easily. 1st to second is closer which get's rid of that bogged down feel that the type 9 had. 2nd to 3rd is the biggest change. My car used to change character from 2nd to 3rd but now it seems like a natural progression all the way up the box.

 

It does whine a bit more than a fully helical box but nothing like a straight cut. I don't find it at all intrusive.

 

If money allows, I'd get a 6-speed for your car. It really is a fantastic piece of kit and is purpose built for youe engine. The SPC box is a huge improvement on the standard type 9 but not the optimum solution that the 6 speed is for the Rover engines. The 6 speed is much more expensive though!

 

Alex Wong

alex.wong@lotus7club.co.uk

www.alexwong.net

Home : 44-(0)121-440 6972

Fax : 44-(0)121-440 4601

[Nick]

Thanks Alex - not what I wanted to hear really! Ie, the SPC is better than what I have but will cost x; the 6 speed is really good but will cost x to the power of x! sad.gif

 

Nick

 

Edited by - Nick on 31 Aug 2000 12:59:05