Dry Sump X/Flow - Major Oil Problems

[Baby Bucket]

Hello All,

 

Here's the problem.

 

Baby B keeps blowing the oil seal on the oil filters. It has managed this trick three times (3 different filters, 2 different makes) since the weekend. It has deposited around 8 litres of oil on my drive sad.gif.

 

It only happens on start-up (thank goodness). The car is a 1.6 x/flow with dry sump, with a remote Mocal filter housing.

 

The only recent change was the fitment of an oil-water cooler in place of the oil-air cooler and a new breather cap.

 

Any suggestions ? As far as I am aware, none of the filters had a non-return valve. Also well it does start ok it runs with 5 Bar oil pressure @ 3,000 rpm and has managed around 100 miles over the last few days.

 

All suggestions very gratefully received, especially as I am booked on a track day next week.

 

Thanks

 

Peter

[Baby Bucket]

Hello All,

 

Further question. Do x/flow dry sump oil pumps have a oil pressure release valve ?

 

Thanks

 

Peter

 

 

[J.R.]

Have had same problem on both a standard sumped Zetec which was due to pressure relief valve sticking and also on a dry sumped x/flow.

 

On the x/flow the pressure relief valve was not sticking but i had restrictive oil lines (too small) which when the oil was cold and during braking (scavenging) the pressure guage would go off the scale and once the filter O ring blew.

 

Fittinglarger oil lines cured it, whatwas happening was that when the oil was cold and thicker the restrictive oil line returning scavenged and pressure relieved oil back to the oil tank couldnt cope so there was a sudden surge felt at the pressure stage of the pump.

 

Sounds like your new oil cooler is too restrictive, is it in the scavenge or pressure line?

[I.Mupferit]

Peter,

 

5 Bar oil pressure sounds extraordinarily high for a X/Flow. Does it have a high pressure, high capacity oil pump?

If not, I would expect to see an oil pressure of up to 3 Bar max. for a X/Flow in good condition.

 

Brent

[Baby Bucket]

Thanks for the replies.

 

J.R. Sounds like you had a similar problem. The oil cooler is in the scavenge line, back to the dry sump oil tank.

 

Brent

 

The oil pump is a 5-port dry sump unit, so yes it is high capacity, high pressure.

 

Thanks

 

Peter

[Jam Mad]

talk to roger king at the se7ens workshop, he posted a few weeks ago on a similar thread... apparently they all drop oil, but i'll leave it to him to go into why, and how best to remedy it.

 

j

[Graham Perry]

Up to 5.5 bar regularly appears on my Crossflow with Dry sump, but it only appears when revs get much over about 7000. 2 to 4 bar is the norm. Never had Baby buckets problem though. I presume you are using a high quality filter ? The standard Ford ones are very made, so I always use them. I think EFL500 is the one I use on my remote housing, its slightly shallower than earlier ones.

 

I think what is needed here is the definative opinion of RK, as Jam Mad says.

[Peter T]

Peter have you checked that the romote mocal filter has not been reversed since fitment of the new cooler? It is quite possible that you are trying to flow the oil backwards through the filter,this would not help especially if the filter incorparates a non return vavle. My dry sumped x-flow withstands 6 bar pressure with no leaks at all. What filters are you using?

 

C7 PWT X-Flow all Steel

Its in and running (just)

[Paul Turner]

Second what Peter T says, reversing the pipes on the remote filter housing could help cause the filter poblems. The pressure relief valve is normally on the pump face with a locking nut, I ran mine at about 65psi hot cruise 4400rpm ish (4.5 bar) and 20 psi hot idle (1.5 bar) using either 5w/40 or 10w/40 oils. The various engines I had in ran at this setting for 11 years without ever needing to re-adjust the pressure relief valve. I used whatever filter the factors had in stock after my supply of genuine Ford x-flow filters expired, non had a valve in. The only problem was a bizarre one about a year after first fitting the system, a friend advised me to use a well known brand of "racing" 20w/50 oil, when started from cold the pressure was only about 30psi but as the engined warmed the pressure rose. After a few days I dropped the oil out and put in some of my previous type and normality returned, the only reason appeared to have been the oil was to thick to be pumped to the remote filter and back when cold.

 

Paul

[Roger King]

I would second the advice about using an EFL500 filter. If the filter housing is plumbed backwards so the oil flows the wrong way through the filter, the engine will suffer instant death due to oil starvation. Older filters didn't have this problem, but the newer ones have been fitted with a non-return valve that simply won't let oil flow at all in the wrong direction.

 

There is an adjustable relief valve on a dry sump pump. If you are using the usual Titan Motorsport pump (often branded as something else), it is the screw that pokes out of the end cover of the pump and has one or two locking nuts on it. Loosen the nut(s) and wind the screw out to reduce pressure or in to increase it. Note that the effect of a relief valve is to limit maximum pressure - it cannot be used to increase pressure at tickover.

 

A dry sump Crossflow would normally run 4 bar to 5.5 bar when hot and at high revs. It is not uncommon to see nearly 10 bar when the oil is cold, so don't rev the engine much until there is some heat in the oil.

 

I'm not sure why you are having filter problems, but possible causes could be:-

 

Poor quality filter

Not doing it up tight enough

Damaged filter housing

 

Your oil hoses from the pump to filter and back to engine would normally be 1/2"