Tony Martyr Posted April 7, 2002 Share Posted April 7, 2002 First time I get a professional organisation (term used loosely) to change a k series cam belt and alternator belt they forget to tighten the crankshaft pulley retaining bolt! I drove home (in pouring rain with hood up) and was not aware of problems. Then returning from overseas I start the car up and hear a very strange tinkling noise. The pulley is off the register and jangling around. On inspection I find that there is not sign of a drive peg that fits into the pulley hub although there seems to be something in the keyway of the cam belt pulley behind it. Question: Are both pulleys driven by a common key? I assume that the loosening pulley has sheared off the drive lug or key. I have got the car running but the drive is now relying on the clamping force of the bolt. Being very pissed off at missing this fine weather I am going to risk driving it back the 50 miles to the Caterham agents that caused the problem - is this considered a sensible risk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gridgway Posted April 7, 2002 Share Posted April 7, 2002 I would be veyr nervous at doing it. Having had a toasted engine when the pulleys came off, it's an expensive risk! Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyR Posted April 7, 2002 Share Posted April 7, 2002 Tony, Do not take the risk. Think of the cost if the pulley slips. TonyR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Day Posted April 7, 2002 Share Posted April 7, 2002 Tony They caused the problem, get them to recover the car & fix it. See you on Le-Sept. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Walker Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Tony, The crank pulley is only located by the clamping force of the bolt and a tiny ridge/protrusion on the crankshaft timing gear, this is again clamped by the same bolt but is located by sliding over two machined flat sections on the end of the crank. I should examine the crank timing gear and see if the ridge is present and if it is its simply a matter of retightening the crankshaft pully bolt. Before tightening I would check if you have the auto timing belt tensioner or the manual. If you have the auto ( Black Plastic one non adjustable) then simply re-torque the crank pulley bolt to 148 lbft. If you have the manual tensioner I would mark its position then slacken it off a tad then re-torque the crank pulley bolt then reset the belt tension. Next step is remove the spark plugs and wind the engine round and check that the cam timing is still correct ie, crank pulley set to 90DBTC both cam pulleys timing marks should align with each other and the mark on the rear of the belt cover. I certainly would not advise you to run it without checking the valve timing, and should you find that its slipped, I would advise you to have the head off and check for damage or a compression test at the very least. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Tony, I think Rob is scare-mongering a bit - no need to take the head off; a 1.6 Supersport has plenty of tolerance for a bit of mis-timing and if it was running at the point you noticed something amiss then it will be fine. I would inspect the c/s timing pulley closely to see if it is damaged. As Rob described, the timing gear has a lug on it to locate the pulley - it is itself located on the c/s by a single flat. Replace both if they are damaged. The bolt should be fitted with *lots* of medium strength Loctite and torqued to 120lbft - this can be done in the chassis in a high gear with the brakes on. Where exactly are you in the West. I am more westward than usual and could be persuaded to come down and help you (with any tools required) this Wednesday or Thursday evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V7 SLR Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Tony's in Inkberrow, Worcs. The local L7 club's on Weds night. Not sure if Tony's going to come now, but if he did I could bring suitable tools for a car-park repair. Welcome to come over and direct such a repair if you're in the area PC. Would give us something different to talk about for a change (instead of cars). smile.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Worcs is doable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnty Lyons Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 I find it's actually easier if you lock the f/wheel via the aperature just below the clutch cable entry as the top gear brakes method still allows a fair bit of flex, I would be suprised if the locating spud is worn down just depends how long the crank pully has been slipping it would be near impossible with the size of the flat fro the timing to have slipped and if it had it would have done so big tim and the car would have stopped it's either there or not no half way house so don't panic Tony.smile.gif Boy am I glad I do all my own work!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Agreed that the brakes method isn't ideal because of the springing in the clutch - not a problem with a race clutch. For the same reason, a non-race clutch and the brakes should not be used for undoing the bolt as this would reverse the load on the clutch straps leading to the possibility of later failure. How do you restrain the flywheel through the aperture? I'm asking because I have a great tool for doing this with the engine out of the car, but in-car is still a mystery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Walker Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 I find it a little worrying that the Haynes book of lies quotes 120lb ft and the Lotus Elise 205 Nm for the crank pulley bolt torque. I wonder who is correct?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Sewell Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 Pretty much both, 200Nm = 133lbft - so the difference is minimal... Low tech luddite - xflow and proud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gridgway Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 205NM is 147lbft by my dodgy maths which is 10% off. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjwb Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 205 Nm = 151.2 lbf/ft actually.wink.gif Steve B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Bees Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 My Haynes manual quotes a much bigger figure than 120lbft - don't have it to hand here in the "office" but ISTR it's IRO 160. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gridgway Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 151.20024 actually :-) Graham (really must learn how to do smileys) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Carmichael Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 My mistake for trying to remember the figure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Martyr Posted April 8, 2002 Author Share Posted April 8, 2002 You can't help but be impressed by this forum can you? Thanks to all for the advice. The miscreant company has offered to collect the car by trailer and give it a full check over replacing any damaged parts. They are collecting it on Wednesday so I will be having to sneak into the L7OC pub meet via the back door. Peter please come and join us you will be made most welcome - Nigel might even buy you a lemonande. You might have difficulty finding the pub so you could come to my place which is in Inkberrow on the Alcester Worcester road. If in doubt ring me on 07785 256973 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V7 SLR Posted April 8, 2002 Share Posted April 8, 2002 We also have John Gathard visiting us this week, from Devon so the pub should be quite entertaining. RE: buying a drink... hmm, I might... wink.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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