Tech Forum - Changes to Classes for 2007

[Jason Plato]

Those that have written in this forum supported a years grace in banning ACB's were :

Martin B

ShaunE

Richard Price

Me

Simon Rogers

 

Some of us couldnt attend the forum, this shouldnt be repeatedly used as a reason for dismissing our opinion.

 

 

 

 

 

here is C7 TOP

South Wales AO

 

Edited by - Dave Jackson on 22 Nov 2006 08:05:40

[Davey Bee]

Add my name to that support.

 

R600 VX here

[david nelson]

The aim of the new regs is to include more members.

 

the ACB banning was discussed. A vote was taken and the end result was no acb 10's

 

There are cost implications to all those that run ACB10's last year. I had planned on using my 2005 and 2006 tyres due to change in work/ lack of money. But if i was planning to do all the rounds, be compedative i would have had to buy new ACB 10's.

 

For me the new regs give the opertunity for all to compeate. this can only be a good thing.

 

 

David

[KenEvans]

I am no longer in class 4 but in class 5 and will now expect to find it hard to get into the top three, but I'm happy with that because the competition will be good. I will have to buy a new set of whatever the best set of list 1B's turn out to be.

 

Also, because I will be doing the Midland Hillclimb Championship roadgoing class I will need a set of fresh list 1A's and swap over from event to event having to immediately adapt to the different tyre on each occasion.

 

Am I complaining? No. Because it's for the greaster good of the championship.

 

Ken

[DSL]

There will never be a good time to ban anything that some poeple feel passionatley about.

 

However looking at it realistically, its the end of the season so most people who have undertaken a fullish years competition should have used the best of their tyres As such if ACB's had been allowed a grace period for next year, the likelyhood is that at some point all the competative people amongst us (ie most 😬) would have had to purchase another set of them, thus being in a similar situation at the end of the following year.

 

If not there's always the option to use them up in class 6, & be the best of the none slick shod cars *thumbup*

 

Best to take the pain now & look forward to the new challenge for next season

[robmar]

at the outset what was agreed by everyone (in the room), and I think/hope a sentiment echo'd by all competitors who compete in the l7 championship

 

is that the aim of our championship is entry level motorsport that should be as accesible and as open as possible, and to that aim we should be continually looking at ways that make our championship more attractive to new competitors.

 

Over the years we have heard many people complaining that becuase we allow acb10 c24's that this is a big blocker/turn off for new people wanting to enter (yes we have heard the argument for and against this many times) so it was put tot he vote should we continue to allow these tyres, I think it went something like 3-1 in favour of excluding them, I voted to keep them by the way.

 

Then we had a discussion about the merits of keeping them for another year or more, and this went back and forth some more, all the acb10 runners contributed to the discussion and had there chance to say if they would be buying more tyres/had tyres tey where plannign to use etc for next year etc Then with the orgininal goal of what our championship is about and what our aims are, and the consensus was that that should be of primary importance and so as such a vote was taken again as to should we do this for 07 or 08 and I think it was almost unaminous that we should bite the bullet and do for next year.

 

I suspect if more people had turned up who are now bringing up the subject maybe things would have been different, I am not saying that everyone should have attended and I do understand that some people just couldn't make it due to prior agreements/arrangements. I do understand the £££ impact this will have (me included but to a less extent as I would have got new tyres anyway for next year). But if sit back and reflect for a few mninutes this is for the benefit of the club its members and the championship as a whole and as someone (i forget who) raised on a previous topic

 

We should not focus on what satisfies the people who are currently leading classes or the vocal minority on here

---

 

and

 

we need to consider the championship and what is required to bring in more entrie

---

 

personally I would liked to have kept ACB's indefinatly but as soon as the decision was made I agreed witht he majority that we should do it ASAP

 

hopefully I have got the facts right for how things transpired at the meeting, and Am sure if incorrect someone will correct me

 

Rob

 

 

[Jason Plato]

Best to take the pain now

 

Ok .......I'll tell her when I get home this evening 😬

 

 

 

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[Mark Durrant]

Dave

 

No one is dismissing your views or that of the others who have posted on here. The future of ACB10's was discussed at length (more than any other topic) by approximately 25 competitors on Sunday including those who use this tyre. A vote was taken, I cannot recall the majority but it was overwhelming to change to List 1a and List 1b radials only for Class 4 & 5 or List 1b radials only for Class 3. The changes that have been made are for the good of the championship as a whole and as with any change there will be those who benefit and those who do not. Remember this not only effects people who use ACB10's but those who competed on List 1a's last year.

 

Mark D

Comp Sec

 

 

Edited by - Mark Durrant on 22 Nov 2006 09:12:58

[DSL]

Perhaps in your case wait till next year before telling her, she's suffered enough this year 😬 😬 *thumbup*

[Jason Plato]

it was me that said those quotes above and I still wholeheartedly agree that in the long term it will be for the good of the club championship, But .... the decision to ban these tyres has hit many of the current championship competitors and supporters quite hard financially when it didn't have to be done that way. That is my only complaint. I quoted the vocal minority driving the direction of the championship, but consideration should be also given for the non vocal majority in what is a low cost end of the motor sport spectrum

 

It has been evident in the past and apparent now that this situation will not be changed as a result of any discussion on here - simply no feedback will be provided. So I'll give up moaning.

 

I've always believed that you get out what you put in to a club like this, I'm now reflecting on that naive outlook.

 

 

 

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[robmar]

Dave I hope you don't change your naive outlook

 

you could always use them as expensive but excellent trackdays tyres

[Manxseven]

moving on from tyres, 😬

 

I am interested in how the BHP limits will be enforced,

 

In Marks first post he states;

 

We intend to put controls in place to deal with the power limits for classes 2-4 but as this championship is about a fun entry level of motorsport I doubt and hope they they will need to be exercised

 

The controls in place will need to be very robust.

Will a rolling road be appointed for all testing?

Who will pay for the test and getting to/from the garage. (The competitor or Club?)

 

Although this is fun entry level of motorsport, we all know that once the championship starts, some will take it seriously especially if they are committing to doing the championship and not the odd round here and there.

 

Tell me to shut up if you want to

 

 

 

Caterham Fireblade here

 

 

 

Edited by - Manxseven on 22 Nov 2006 21:04:12

[Jason Plato]

I was at a club area meet last night and a competitor who hasnt entered previously because he felt that his car is uncompetitve in class 5 said "yeah great - I'll be able to enter class 4 " , But " you have 203 bhp " I asked , "yeah but whos gonna check, whos gonna know if a VVC head on a K with bottie doddles has 180bhp or 245 bhp if you dont have a speed trap 🤔"

 

☹️

 

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[david nelson]

It is hoped that people will be honest. I am sure the regs/ spirt of the regs will be used if needed.

 

David

[Jason Plato]

you been sniffing those massage oils again TM

 

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[Shaun_E]

There will always be some 🙆🏻 who has that attitude. To them I say - why not just pop to the local trophy shop and buy some cups, have your name engraved on them, pop them on the mantelpiece and tell everyone what a hero you are.

 

Yellow SL #32

[metal mickey]

I asked this very question and Mark gave a detailed reply The problem is 10hp is all it takes to win by the very smallest of margins and as we all know one RR does not read the same as another. Very diffecult to police and I do hope the 'spirit' is observed.

[CageyH]

I'm not going to get my car mapped by Field Motorsport

 

As I have a VHPD engine (with 20k on it) on Jenveys, an emerald and verniers, is it 190 BHP, or 190+ BHP?

 

I have not had it on a rolling road, and probably won't in the near future. Spent too much this side of christmas! What class do I go in? All I know, the engine is supposed to develop 190 BHP when set up correctly.

As a potential new competitor, class 4 would be good for me, but under the spirit of the regs, as it has been modified, I guess class 5 would be fair.

 

It does not really matter to me, as I don't expect to be competitive.

I bought my VHPD engine without the KV6's as I already had jenveys, and I don't think my car will run well on a 1.6 K ss ECU, hence the emerald.

 

With 30BHP less, and at least 20% less talent and 100% experience, there is no real benefit for me, apart from not having to buy ACB10's.

 

I intend to do a few events for fun. That is all

 

The speed trap will only show you a good figure if you get decent drive out of a corner.

With an open diff, and less sticky tyres, I don't expect my speed to be as high as a car with 20bhp less, stickier tyres and an LSD.

 

Just goes to show, you can't please everybody

 

Only dead fish go with the flow....

[CageyH]

Oh, if I put a Caterham Supersport spark plug cover on my VHPD, can I pretend it is a 1.8 Supersport?

 

Only dead fish go with the flow....

[Shaun_E]

VHPD with Jenvey's, Emerald and Verniers should see you over 200bhp - it's probably better than a stock R400. See you in class 5 .

Darren Luke has managed some very good times in an R400 e.g at Mira and Longcross where he beat a host of more powerful machinery, so you won't be hugely outgunned.

My car is nearly 230bhp but I can't get close to the top guys - when I can get within a second or so of them then I'll worry about power, tyres, etc.

Have fun! 😬

 

Yellow SL #32

[CageyH]

But it is a 1.8 K supersport Says so on the spark plug insert....

 

Seriously, what is the difference between this and a DVA 1.8 k?

Dave J's old 1.6 was over 200 BHP.

You will rely heavily on the competitors honesty with this new ruling.

 

Only dead fish go with the flow....

[Graham Perry]

Speed trap times will tell the story. 2mph ahead of the field and no doubt Mark will consider holding an enquiry 😳 You may think that is proscriptive but within a class 2 mph might mean a 10-15 hp difference at the tracks the club uses.

[Mr Happy]

And what wrong with honesty.

 

If your honesty you can sleep at night and wake up HAPPY

[CageyH]

Class 4 is for

Modified K series cars e.g. DVA Power/Emerald

Without a rolling road, how do you know what power you have?

DVA has built some cracking 1.8's. How can you tell a 1.8 from a 1.9?

 

My VHPD in standard set up was probably good for 170-180 BHP.

So by going to different throttle bodies, timing the cams and having an Emerald, I am l*ikely* to get 200 BHP or more if I am lucky.

If I enter my first sprint this year, I will not know how much power I have.

The engine will not be set up to the optimum setting.

Even so, as people think I am likely to have over 200 BHP, I will enter class 5 and take home the wooden spoon.

This is bound to be mine, as I will also be running medium A048's, on heavy wheels.

 

Let's hope everybody else is as honest

 

Only dead fish go with the flow....

[martin b]

Cagey H

Your getting in the swing of this already 😬

You've posted a whole raft of excuses, can't remember their numbers offhand but I can assure you there are several others already claiming the wooden spoon in Class 5

You will make far more difference to your times than the car.

Extra points for original excuses

 

Martin