K series dry sump oil change

[New Barbie]

I need to undertake the first oil change and on the rumour that Caterham had issued a technical bulletin on the blue plate on the bellhousing I rang them as it will be much easier to fettle any bits with the first oil drained.

 

Anyway, for the benefit of those interested, this is the Caterham recommended oil change method (allow at least two days wink.gif)

 

Run engine until oil is warmish to aid the draining process first, not so hot you could burn yourself though. First detach the oil pipe from the sump to the bellhousing at the bellhousing end, drain some oil (the majority) from the end of the pipe. Now remove the other end of that pipe from the sump and then hang the pipe up to drain for about half an hour. Now remove the filter. Now remove the blue plate and clean the crap off it and allow the rest of the bellhousing to drain out.

 

Clean the residue from everything and fill new filter with oil and fit. Replace pipe. Reseal the blue plate with silicon and torque it up, don't rely on the O-ring on the older version. In my case remove oil temp sender and replace with PTFE tape around thread to stop leak (one hopes). Note if you have a leak on the temp sender on standard instruments, not the Stack, you can't do this as the sender earths to the bellhousing.

 

Stick in the new oil, it can go in the tower or the top of the engine, I prefer the dry sump tower.

 

Let car down off jack and there you go.

 

I only asked about the blue plate and I wasn't going to bother with the hose so I thought I'd share the "official" method, does everyone else do the same or not ? I have visions of John Richens doing all this after every track outing for R500OLE.

 

 

 

 

[robmar]

Coutn - nice to know the offical version

 

the only oil change I did I got covered in oil because I removed the blue plate first, then the pipe from the sump but at the sump side, my theory was this would allow as much oil out of the engine and any hanging around not in the bell housing out.

 

I also jacked the front of the car up as much as possible to let gravity help!

 

don't remeber torquing up the bolts on the blue plate, just did it till it felt tiht blush.gif can you remember the setting

 

rob

 

 

[Miraz]

I've got a drain plug fitted into my blue plate so I don't have to mess around with removing/resealing it each time.

 

The downside of filling via the tower on the drysump is that there is an open hole above the clutch just below the tower - gotta be very careful not to screw up...

 

Miraz

[Mike Bees]

> I've got a drain plug fitted into my blue plate

 

Snap! Much less hassle. I also baulked mightily at paying 4ukp a pop for the O-ring... although I'm told they're much cheaper now.

 

Mike

[John Howe]

Isn't the "blue plate" rather on the thin side to tap and drill - did you just use a standard sump plug?

 

JH

 

 

 

[Peter Carmichael]

I use a pump to get the last oil out of the tank without disturbing the plate. If there is significant cr@p in the bottom it is staying there and getting swilled in with the new oil. The engine comes out often enough that I can give the tank a proper clean now and again.

[Mike Bees]

The blue plate is too thin to tap on it's own. I cut a lump of 1/2" thick ali to fit the cutout in the bottom of the tank and attached it to the top of the blue plate. The thread is in the 1/2" lump, and the sump plug head is shrouded (mostly - well it is now I've taken an angle grinder to the head) by the blue plate.

 

Mike

[Miraz]

I made up a new plate with a thicker bit of ali, partly to accomodate the sump plug, and partly so that I could attach a float assembly as an oil level indicator to the plate.

 

Miraz

[robmar]

I am assuming all the extra plates are on the inside, as if it was the underneath surely it would reduce ride hieght too much and be a very weak area if you hit anythiong at speed

 

surely this would mean that you would leave a little reservoir of crud at the bottom

 

rob

[Nick Green]

But I've foune that taking off the hose from the tank to the sump lets out bugger all oil from the engine. Removing the hose from the sump to the scavenge pump lets out over a litre though. I don't bother taking off the tank-sump steel braided jobby anymore.

[Jason Plato]

I use the same method as Nick , quite a volume comes out of the pump if you turn it by hand also .

Never taken the braided pipe off .

 

 

Dave

[Mike Bees]

> I am assuming all the extra plates are on the inside

 

Yes.

 

Mike

[robmar]

so in which case do you have a reservoiur of crud at the bottom that never gets drained out as the plate is raised above the surface of the blue plate?

 

or have you made the plate the same size as the oblong hole under the bottom of of the bell housing / tank?

 

rob

[New Barbie]

The braided hose at the bellhousing end is a sod to get off, I'm sorely tempted to leave it. It has two different sized fixings on the end which refuse to turn independently of each other or the right-angled pipe before the braided section. It turns in the thread in the bellhousing itself but that's it.

 

The blue plate had one small swarf and that was it. Bit concerned the silicon will not adhere as well to the oily surfaces left now but we'll see.

 

I don't want to start bashing spanners with rubber mallets so any tips on the hose ? Although I could just tighten it back up, the damn thing is not getting away with it on principle.

 

 

[Jason Plato]

As we have said earlier - I wouldnt bother taking the braided hose off .

 

Before you stick the bottom blue plate back on - simply wipe the surfaces with some brake / carb cleaner . Make sure thye sealant is capable of withstanding 140c - possible oil temp max .

 

Have you drained the scavenge hose ??

 

Dave

[New Barbie]

Dave

 

I haven't touched any hoses apart from the braided hose. Should I be ?

 

Seems funny that a simple task like an oil change has so many opinions, surely that hose will have drained out through the sump where I've removed the braided hose. It's entirely possible I'm being stupid but please advise.

 

tia

 

 

[Nick Green]

Count,

 

Don't undo the steel braided hose at all. I find it messier than what follows; the oil starts splurging out around the olive as you start to undo it, because as you have found, you don't have a spare hand to keep the olive "joint" closed up while using two spanners to undo the olive nut.

 

Put your finger under the blue plate. Undo two of the screws a few (2-3 ?) turns (I favour the back two for some reason) then undo the front screws by a few more turns than the back ones.

 

With your handy old washing up bowl beneath the plate, just let go of the plate. It will drop down, and the oil will run out, hopefully mostly in the direction of the more undone screws. Then just sit back for a few minutes. The oil will run out of the tank. The first time I did this, about 3.5l of the 5l I knew was in there came out. I know this because I put it into an old oil container with the markings on the outside.

 

I took off the steel-braided hose you are talking of (following caterham's advice) and about a teacup full of oil fell out. Then I thought of it as follows: That hose runs to the front of the sump, for the oil pick up. I presume (not having seen inside the sump, but judging by what fell out) that this is a small cavity. The rest of the sump must be the collector for the scavenge pump. (Is that assumption correct, or is the sump casting one big trough ??)

 

I took the hose off that runs up to the bottom of the scavenge pump, and over a litre of oil ran out (again, using the old oil container measurement). Allowing for oil caught up around the filter, etc, that was my 5l accounted for.

 

I would have thought you don't want to be disturbing the olive joints any more than you have to, and as the oil "return" obtained by removing the steel-braided hose is pretty poor, I don't see the point in removing the steel-braided hoses on an oil change.

 

Hope this helps; I think Dave's normally gone home by now wink.gif

 

Edited by - nick green on 8 Mar 2002 17:49:58

 

Edited by - nick green on 8 Mar 2002 17:55:49

[John Howe]

Surely, the engine sump plug will cater for any oil in the scavenge pipe

 

JH

 

 

[Jason Plato]

Yeah - your right Nick .... long gone by 5.30 smile.gif

 

I follow nicks method , plus give the scavenge pump a few revs by hand in reverse .

 

Dave

[Peter Carmichael]

John,

 

There isn't an engine sump plug.

[Adam]

Count

 

Once youve changed the oil ..... turn the engine over with the ignition immobillised for 30-60 secs. This is especially important if you start draining the pipes etc.

 

Not following this was the caused, in Caterhams view, that my number one bearing disintegrated on a ~1500 mile engine. Was a very expensive oil change... although Caterhan did provide the new crank&bearings, leaving me with the labour costs (Ouch).

 

Maybe this is just common sense - but seems I might have been short changed.

 

Adam

[John Howe]

John,

 

There isn't an engine sump plug.

 

Peter, there is on mine with a magnetic insert. Its at the back inline with the nearside flywheel rim - perhaps its a new modification from Caterham

 

JH

 

 

[Nick Green]

In the interest of completeness, I have been informed by a friend who has the later non-gasketted blue plate, that simply "letting go" of the plate won't always cause it to drop down. Depends how much silicon sealant has been applied, apparently.

[Jason Plato]

Nick ...... the "letting go " of the blue plate should not be tested live wink.gif . This has in the past resulted in liberal use of er' of the nearsides face clenser .

 

I would suggest either a gentle swivvel by hand or a plastic bag over your head .

 

teeth.gif

Dave

[New Barbie]

My blue plate did not need to be held on, I had to bash it with a soft-faced hammer to loosen its grip.

 

I've cleaned it with brake cleaner and refitted.

 

Be aware there are various figures for the amount of oil in a dry sump system and most are different. The book says 6 litres and that was too much - cue catch tank full of crap. I'm pretty sure I drained out the lot so I'm curious as to the correct figure. As you can't measure the oil cold and you hardly want to start the engine with too little, knowing how much to put in is a bit of a fine art. Any concesus on how much for a 1.6K SS with Caterham dry sump system.

 

I did turn the car over for a while before it fired, it's easy as you just don't imobilise it, the starter will still fire.