Xflow Gearbox upgrade

[NevDyson]

Having now decided to get the Engine changed due to suspect piston ring failure, and thus oil over pressure I want to upgrade the gearbox as well. I am considering putting a set of Tran X straight cut gears with a longer first than what is fitted at the moment.

 

However I am a little stumped as I thought the gearbox (4 Speed) was a rocket box, but the one fitted does not have a removable bell housing whereas I thought the Rocket box did. So what type of box is this ?

 

Oh and any recomendations for a race clutch, in for a penny..... and all that

 

 

The link below shows the type I have :-

 

http://www.unibrain.org/gallery/forsale/DSCN1235

 

Any info gratefully received, Norm you must know this I am sure.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

Get In , Sit Down, Shut Up, Hang On. :-)

 

Working next door to Caterham Cars is getting expensive .........

 

 

 

 

Edited by - NevDyson on 7 Aug 2006 17:37:14

[Crudders]

Nev - what you have there is a Type 2 Escort Sport/Mexico box.

 

Quaife do a straight cut close ratio gearset for this box, which is what my car runs. It's on page 30 of the Quaife catalogue, here.

 

Mine has done 32,000 miles without a hitch (that's torn it) and I find the ratios spot on

 

Nice noise too 😬

 

Hope this helps.

 

Crudders

[Jorgen]

anyone who know what the standard ratios in the escort sport box are.

 

Jorgen

[Jorgen]

Could it be these:

4 1.0

3 1.397

2 2.01

1 2.97

 

Found on the www.bghgeartech.co.uk. It says 2000E equivalent. Not sure if that is the standard ratios.

 

Jorgen

 

[Crudders]

The 2000E box is something else again Jorgen. This box would have been fitted to Lotus vintage S3 7s and possibly very early Caterhams.

 

I don't know the Escort Sport standard ratios offhand but will try and find out.

 

Crudders

[Unclefester]

Doesn't the Mexicort box have a cable-operated clutch?

 

The 4 speed box on our 1980 twincam Caterham has a hydaulic clutch operation, and I thought that was the Corsair 2000E box......but I can't say I'm too clued up about it. 🤔

 

NICE PLATE!!!

😬 😬here *eek*

 

Edited by - Unclefester on 7 Aug 2006 18:48:07

[John Ryan]

The Escost sport box I took out of my car had a cable clutch. (as in the Piccie)

[Crudders]

Jorgen - Ford Type 2 ratios are:

 

Standard: 3.656/2.160/1.430/1.000

 

Sport/Mexico (Caterham fitment): 3.337/2.000/1.420/1.000

 

Quaife C/R S/C gearset: 2.500/1.640/1.220/1.000

 

Uncle - you are quite right, the Type 2 has a cable clutch. It sounds as if you have the 2000E 'bullet' box. Does it have a separate bellhousing?

 

Some info on various Ford gearbox types here:

 

TYPE 2

 

Type 2, four speed single rail light duty gearbox as fitted to all Mk1/2 Escorts (Excluding RS/Mexio and Twin Cam). All type 2 gearboxes have integral bellhousings.

 

 

2000E "BULLET"

 

A medium duty 4 speed box with three selector rails. Has been made with various gear selector positions; steering column change, two types of floor change and remote floor change.

 

Fitted in:

· Cortina Mk1

· Lotus Cortina Mk1/2 -68

· Escort Twin Cam

· Escort RS1600/Mexico

 

TYPE 3

 

Type 3, four speed single rail version of the 2000E gearbox.

 

Fitted in:

· Cortina Mk2

· Cortina Mk3 1.3/1.6/1.6GT

· Cortina Mk4/5 1.3, 1.6 (not GT)

· Cortina Mk2

· Lotus Cortina 69-

· Capri Mk1/2/3 1.6 OHC

· Capri Mk1 -8/72 1.6 OHV

· Capri Mk1 2.0 V4

· Sierra 1.6

 

TYPE E

 

4 speed single rail gearbox, used for more demanding applications than the Type 3 box. It is available with or without an integral bellhousing. Often referred to as the 'Rocket' box. (Rocket was the name of the original close-ratio competition gearbox that was based on the Type E).

 

Fitted in:

· Capri 1.6/2.0 82 on

· Cortina Mk3 2.0

· Cortina Mk4/5 1.6GT/2.0/2.3

· Escort RS2000 Mk1/2

· Escort RS Mexico Mk2

· Sierra 1.6/2.0

 

TYPE 9

 

The Type 9 was Fords first RWD five speed box, and based on the Type E. This gearbox is commonly used for 5 speed conversions on older vehicles. Some later versions were available with integral bellhousings, although they are more commonly found with removable bellhousings. A 4wd version of this box was also available for the early XR4x4 models. Power rating: Approx 200BHP

 

Fitted in:

· Capri 1.6/2.0 02/83 on

· Capri 2.8 11/82 on

· Sierra 1.6/1.8/2.0 to 12/88

· Sierra XR4i

· Sierra XR4x4 2.8

 

TYPE F

 

4 speed box with unique side lever shift rods. Fitted in Capri 2.0 72-82

 

 

TYPE 5

 

4 speed, 3 rail heavy duty box, fitted to V6 models.

 

Fitted in:

· Capri 3.0

· Capri 2.8 81-11/82

· Granada Mk1 3.0

· Granada Mk2 2.8

 

MT75

 

The MT-75 5 speed gearbox, that replaced the Type 9. Available in 2wd and 4wd versions. Power rating: Approx 250 BHP

 

Fitted in:

· Sierra 2wd 12/88 on

· Granada 2wd 12/88 on

· Sierra XR4x4

· Sapphire/Escort Cosworth 4wd

· Granada 2.9 4x4

 

 

BORG WARNER T5

 

5 speed HD Borg Warner box. One of the strongest boxes fitted to a production European Ford car - it should be since it originated from the American Mustang. Fitted in Sierra/Sapphire Cosworth 2wd

 

Hope this is of use,

 

Crudders

 

[Crudders]

BTW Nev, I forgot to add that Brent Chiswick will sort you out with a conversion kit for upgrading from a 4 speed Type 2 to a 5 speed Type 9, if you fancy going that route.

 

Brent is often found wibbling in these parts, especially on the North Hants & Berks threads

 

Alternatively I can put you in touch if you send me a blatmail.

 

Cheers,

 

Crudders

[Jorgen]

Nice gearbox overview.

 

Mine is the type 2 box (the sport mexico one) and it has the cable operated clutch. Happy with that for the moment, not at least because I am under the impression that there is a quite big weight penalty if you go to the type 9 gearbox. But a longer first gear in the type 2 box would be nice. Although I think maybe the 2,500 is maybe a little long for a mainly roadgoing car 🤔

 

Jorgen

[NevDyson]

Crudders,

 

Cheers for the info, really helpfull.

 

Ant recommendations on a race clutch ? AP maybe ?

 

 

 

 

Get In , Sit Down, Shut Up, Hang On. :-)

 

Working next door to Caterham Cars is getting expensive .........

 

 

 

[Nigel Riches]

Hi Nev, if you're thinking of increasing engine power, and want to stay with a four speed gearbox, then a change to the "2000E" type box would be advised, as they have stronger internals, and some better ratios, also have a better change action, and the mounting holes for the carrier under the box are only about 0.5" different ( some quick work with a rotary file, make the holes into slots) to the Escort box you have at the moment. the remote change would need to be shortened as would the prop shaft, can't remember if the prop nose is different for the 2000E output shaft, something to consider, or as has been mentioned go for the 5 speed 'box, Oh you may find it necessary to do some tin work on the footwell of the driver side to accomadate the larger bellhousing, and if you have a curved tube between the footboxes this would need to be removed.

And don't forget to fit the speedo drive before installing the gearbox down the tunnel, it's a real prick of a job to fit afterwards.

 

1982. 5 speed, clamshells. B.R.G / Ali. The True Colours.

[Revin Kevin]

Nev,

if your not expecting more than 170bhp I'd stay with the sport box. I run a Tran x type E but you have to modify the gear linkage, gearbox mount and buy a bell housing, all cost and hastle. The sport box is a nice small light box and with the quaife kit should be as sweet as a nut IMHO.

 

Cheers

Chris

[Crudders]

The sport box is a nice small light box and with the quaife kit should be as sweet as a nut IMHO

 

And IME Combined with a low ratio diff the Quaife box is a belter, and to answer Jorgen's point I've never found a 2.5 first gear too high for road use, not with a 4.1 diff anyway. I'm about to find out what it's like with a 3.6 diff but I know others in the club that have run that combination without problems. I must admit I have been tempted by the 5 speed conversion for continental touring holidays though.

 

Nev - YHM re. Brent's 5 speed adapter, further to your BM. And my only experience of a 7 with a race clutch was a pig to drive as it was very heavy with a strong spring action near the biting point that made smooth getaways almost impossible. If you've got the sort of power/anticipated usage that demands a race clutch, you'll probably kill a Type 2 gearbox, IYSWIM. I've always run standard AP clutches and have only ever changed them as a precautionary measure when doing engine work - I've never broken one or worn one out.

 

Crudders

[Revin Kevin]

Crudders,

First gear on my Tran x is 2.48,I run this with a 3.64 diff and 185/70 13's and it's fine on the road. Actualy quite a pleasure as first will take me close to approx 45mph ish, only for a little more clutch slip to get you away rather than the usless first gear with a standard ratio's. Also will cruise at 80mph on the French peages in fourth if it really has to.

 

Cheers

Chris

[c7kjt]

Chris, you're not helping, after driving your car and reading the above I'm now trying to work out how I'm going to explain to Ros why, after a complete rebuild last winter, that I need to take engine & gb out of the car again (and blow the best part in £1K in the process) 😬 😬

 

Kevin Thomas

The 7 Gallery... with added BBCi

 

[Unclefester]

Crudders, Yes, the box in our twincam, which has the Escort RS rear axle, has a separate bellhousing and also hydraulic clutch....so does that make it the 'bullet' box?

 

NICE PLATE!!!

😬 😬here *eek*

[Revin Kevin]

fester,

Sounds likely with that combination to be a 2000E, Bullet being the close ratio kit that fits this box.

Kevin,

You know it's right, £ for the box and if you get it built and delivered only a days work to have the old one out and fit the new.

 

[andy couchman]

Another vote for the Quaife kit (although the gears do whine in 1st to 3rd but not in 4th, which has a 1:1 ratio).

 

Anyone know how to best improve the gearchange tho? Mine's always felt sloppy, although it works OK.

 

Andy

[PAC]

Nev,

I run the sport box with quaife straight cut internals . Yes it looks like the @rse end of a tractor but it works well!

 

I was put off going to the type 9 because of the weight penalty.

In place of that fith gear I bought a trailer for motorways instead 😬 Yes, slightly more expensive, but don't tell the wife.

 

The straight gears are VERY noisy though, cruising through town it sounds like a gas turbine!! Only fun for ten minutes

 

I would seriously think hard if you need a racing clutch - a few hours in traffic and your passenger will either be seasick, or get whiplash, Failing that you'll have a red face after stalling it for the fifth time [they are not designed for feathering].

Just my two pennies worth.

 

Andy,have you checked the remote linkage is all 'tight'?

Paul

 

Edited by - PAC on 9 Aug 2006 15:14:42

[Normans_Ghost]

PAC, you can get very good with a comp clutch after making an arse of yourself for a week or two.

 

I only stall it about 6 times a week now 😬

 

Not really, adjust idle to 900-1100 so you can gently relaese clutch and then accelerate. You get so good at the co-ordination no one will notice.

 

For reasons that most know, I hav a single plate AP unit in at the moment. I will be putting the twin plate back over the winter as the single can't take 8500 rpm change ups. Other than that it's very nice compared to a twin plate so if your sub 200 bhp the single plate may be the answer.

 

(better go and read pp1 now)

 

Norman Verona, 1989 BDR 220bhp, Reg: B16BDR, Mem No 2166, the full story here

You and your seven to The French Blatting Company Limited

[Normans_Ghost]

Nev, look at the tech support pages here (Burton Power)

 

It's same as Crudders info but with piccies.

 

Norman Verona, 1989 BDR 220bhp, Reg: B16BDR, Mem No 2166, the full story here

You and your seven to The French Blatting Company Limited

[Crudders]

Chris - thanks for the tip, I was concerned that I wouldn't get on with the 2.5 1st/3.6:1 diff combo and be tempted to pop the 4.1:1 axle back in. One of these days I'll try out my 4.55:1 diff which is still in the plywood Leyland case (a tip off from Neilsjuke who spotted it in Freeads - ta mate ). Should be a hoot

 

Andy - there are 4 small plastic top hat bushes in the parallel link remote gearshift setup, which could be worn. Alternatively the bolts securing the links to the two gearsticks (one 'box mounted, one chassis mounted) could be slack, as they only rely on nyloc nuts for tightness. I've just replaced all the wearing parts on my remote and it has improved the shift quite noticeably.

 

Uncle - the 2000E is more often than not referred to as a 'Bullet Box' just as a Type E is usually called a 'Rocket Box', although the names originally applied only to the close ratio versions as Chris mentioned.

 

Norm - nice work, and that wasn't even the source of my own cunning and sneaky plagiarism

 

Cruds

 

 

[Nigel Riches]

Something which may help to make the remote change operate better is to brace the two plates, so there's no lost movement in a twisting action, it certainly improved mine before I made the solid one I have now, complete with Oilite bushes. but that was a mission.

 

1982. 5 speed, clamshells. B.R.G / Ali. The True Colours.

[andy couchman]

Thanks - yes, done all that and it still feels like jelly .

 

The 2.5 to 1 ratio for first is fine - with the standard gearbox it was always a question of whether to use 2nd for starts. Even on steep hills in traffic, should not be a problem.

 

Unless you are getting clutch slip I would think about retaining the standard clutch.

 

Too many road drivers don't know how to run a race clutch (apologies if you do!)and road techniques like riding the clutch and slipping the clutch are very much frowned in race circles. Tom Walkinshaw used to give the Jag sports car drivers a right rollicking if he heard them ever slipping the clutch apparently.

 

Andy